Wolfsbane

[Set]

Now in some old werewolf legends an herb known as wolfsbane was said to be able to both make and cure werewolves. This is, however, one thing I absolutely do not want to see used in the movie. The herb itself, sometimes referred to as Monkshood, is a very poisonous plant. Just touching it with bare skin can cause serious problems. I'm not sure where the theory that it could cure werewolves came from but knowing what I do about this plant it's more likely it would simply kill them. So no "were cures" made of wolfsbane, ok?

[Apokryltaros]

I have never ever heard of any references to wolfsbane/monkshod/Aconitum sp. being able to cure people of being werewolves. On the other hand, I do know of various legends that use sprigs of yew or ash in curing people of being werewolves. If wolfsbane could cure werewolves from being werewolves, then it would probably bear a more wolf-friendly common name.
The legends that claim that wolfsbane was used to turn people into werewolves was that it was one of the main ingredients in those legendary "devil's ointments," along with the rendered fat of unbaptized babies. Wolfsbane contains neurotoxins that, if rubbed lightly onto the skin, stimulate the nerve endings in one's hair folicles so that that one gets the sensation of having one's hair growing out at a fantastic rate.
It was also used in the "flying ointments" used by some alleged witches caught by witch-hunters and inquistors.

[ChaosWolf]

I've heard mostly of wolfsbane being used as the name suggests, and repelling wolves/werewolves, much like garlic does for vampires.

Besides, the only Wolfsbane I like is the X-Men kind.

[Terastas]

I've never heard of wolfsbane curing werewolves, but I have heard it can be used to kill them.

The only other plant I've heard used in such a way is Belladonna, AKA: Deadly Nightshade.

If we're basing our ideas on the legends, however, I don't think Wolfsbane and Belladonna or special in any way. Their probably just poisonous enough to kill a man; even one with the enhanced regenerative capabilities of a werewolf.

[WolfVanZandt]

Wolfsbane contains a powerful cardiac drug caled aconite. Like many alkaloid poisons, used very judiciously, it could be used as a hallucinogen. Wolfsbane was used in some of the old transformation ointments. I wouldn't suggest that people try that at home. The difference between the hallucinogenic dose and the lethal dose is rather small.

[Apokryltaros]

Wolfsbane contains a powerful cardiac drug caled aconite. Like many alkaloid poisons, used very judiciously, it could be used as a hallucinogen. Wolfsbane was used in some of the old transformation ointments. I wouldn't suggest that people try that at home. The difference between the hallucinogenic dose and the lethal dose is rather small.

Then, apparently, the ointments were to help their users utilize the optimal tripping dose, and not die horribly and in great pain.

[WolfVanZandt]

Yes, that's it.

[Apokryltaros]

Yes, that's it.

The talk of using the fat of cats, and wolves and unbaptized children was no doubt a product of babbling under torture.

[WolfVanZandt]

Yes, I would think so. But the ointment itself, using drugs like aconite, belladonna, and foxgove certainly existed.

There's a good bit of evidence that the description of the Black Sabbath originated with the church. The ideas were planted in the minds of ignorant peasants during the years of the Inquisition. Again, Carlos Ginzberg is a good source of information.

[WordWolf]

The talk of using the fat of cats, and wolves and unbaptized children was no doubt a product of babbling under torture.

It was simpler than that-

The Inquisitors decided they knew the "truth" long before they started,
and their goal was to elicit a "confession" that matched their
laundry list.

So, it wasn't people babbling the first thing on their mind,
it was torture and operant conditioning.

Ever hear of prisoners of war told to read a script about being treated
fairly and denouncing their country?
Or told to sign a "confession" they had nothing to do with?
It's not that different.

Testimony from mental deficients like Giles Garnier made it clear
that he didn't understand what was going on, but he was confessing
exactly what they wanted him to-eventually.
We'll never know for sure what he really DID do.

Some people think the Inquisition was primarily a money-maker,
an excuse to seize property and land.

Others cite the outcasts swept up, and the men convicted of
lycanthropy, and the women convicted of witchcraft,
and conclude it was a means of social control,
whereby the Inquisition defined who was "other", thus closing the
ranks for those who weren't "other." I'm inclined to agree with
this position. Blaming all your problems on someone different is
a time-honoured tradition practiced to this day.
(There are websites for radical Muslims that are blaming the
United States for the tsunami that hit Indonesia and the rest.)

[WolfVanZandt]

Certanly. And that was a time when the Catholic church was losing lands, converts, and political power. They were edgy and dangerous, powerful and big. And the Proestation hadn't gotten a good foothold yet so the Catholic government cold kill with impunity.
And Werewolves no longer fit into their world view and were also some of the first Potestants - so they had to go along with the "witches", Jews (who were to powerful financially), Gypsies, and other fringe elements.

And, hi, WordWolf. Good to see you.

[Apokryltaros]

Certanly. And that was a time when the Catholic church was losing lands, converts, and political power. They were edgy and dangerous, powerful and big. And the Proestation hadn't gotten a good foothold yet so the Catholic government cold kill with impunity.
And Werewolves no longer fit into their world view and were also some of the first Potestants - so they had to go along with the "witches", Jews (who were to powerful financially), Gypsies, and other fringe elements.

Hence some French stories of Hugenots being werewolves...

[WolfVanZandt]

Aye, and frankly, "Werewolf" became something like "witch". Say that someone's a Werewof and they'd burn them at the stake whether there was any reason to believe it or not.

I wonder if there were ever any Hugenot Werewolves.

[Bete]

Here's a link for you all regarding wolfsbane:
http://www.alchemy-works.com/aconitum_vulparia.html

[Scott Gardener]

You've already covered most of the points I wanted to cover.

The only reference I know saying that wolvesbane curing lycanthropy is one of the appendicies of the first edition of the AD&D Dungeon Master's Guide--hardly a definitive reference on real-world folklore, since it was never intended to cover anything other than a game setting.

It's an ingredient in shapeshifting ointments, again probably because of its anticholinergic properties--it shuts down the parasympathetic systems of the body involved in routine maintainance, throwing one into fight-or-flight mode.

You can find homeopathic remedies containing aconite, and for that matter belladonna. These agents have been diluted down to safe levels, and are offered at some health food stores as fever remedies. I've used them myself, and they work reasonably well.

I've contemplated having werewolves use the stuff as an herbal remedy for relieving the pain of the first few shapeshifts, or easing the initial infection following a bite.

[WolfVanZandt]

Since it has been used for erysephalis (a dangerous staph infection in the skin) and inflammatory conditions amd it has sedative properties, I could see that. I would prescribe (heh, Doctor Wolf on call) an admixture of some form of antispasmodic such as, oh, cinquefoil. The problem with Aconite is that, although it works well with smooth muscles; it doesn't have a lot of affects on skeletal muscle.

[Lupin]

But, (through a long chain of thought), this brings some questions to my mind. Does the plant wolfbane have any effect on a werewolf?

In a high enough dose it's poisonus to regular humans. I don't see why it would be different for werewolves.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolfsbane

[white]

Well, there're the regenerative capabilities. I'd say it's just the same as any other poison.

[Lupin]

Well, there're the regenerative capabilities. I'd say it's just the same as any other poison.

Well the active chemical is a neurotoxin. I'm not sure how regeneration would work against that.

[white]

Probably not very well, but there are a lot of details it would depend on.

[Figarou]

Ok...this was split from another thread.

[Hearth]

Aconite has been ascribed with supernatural powers relating to werewolves and other lycanthropes, either to repel them or in some way induce their lycanthropic condition.

That's from wikipedia...

[Set]

Didn't we already have a topic on wolfsbane somewhere?

I distinctly remember mentioning it's also called monkshood.

[Ronkonkoma]

Didn't we already have a topic on wolfsbane somewhere?

I distinctly remember mentioning it's also called monkshood.

discussed here: http://www.calypso-blue.com/werewolf/vi ... .php?t=206

[Apokryltaros]

Didn't we already have a topic on wolfsbane somewhere?

I distinctly remember mentioning it's also called monkshood.

discussed here: http://www.calypso-blue.com/werewolf/vi ... .php?t=206

Monkshod is the "garden" name of wolfsbane, named so for its pretty blue flowers that suggest the hoods and robes of monks.
Oh, and FYI, a lethal dose of monkshod that can kill a person in a very small amount.