Real Werewolves, are they out there.

The place to talk about where a lot of things started. Stories and history, references, etc.

Do you think werewolves exist?

Yes
171
56%
No
82
27%
2 - Doesn’t really care either way
55
18%
 
Total votes: 308

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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Wselfwulf »

Imagine getting bit by an antiwerewolf
Anti-werewolf. A werewolf made of antimatter. What the hell. That is so absurdly awesome.
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by DarkOriaes »

haha very true. Sometimes people are thinking that the true link of the whole werewolf term is coming from a human heritage. I can't place my finger on what it was called exactly, but its about how the child is covered completely in hair.
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by blackwolfhell »

that is a real medical whatever. And that could be related to monkeys when you think about it.
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Zurrealizm »

Yes and No for me.

From a human point of view, without concrete evidence and exposure, I would firmly state that werewolves doesn't or cannot exist.

But from my point of view, why not? Just because I may not believe that werewolves exist doesn't mean I am correct. I am open and fascinated to the idea that werewolves and any other mythological creatures could exist, and it's always a good idea to keep an open mind no matter what you believe that may or may not be true.

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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Grey »

If not, then what are we? :?
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by IndianaJones »

We are just Werewolf fans who appreciates werewolves as mystical shape-shifting beings rather than blood-thirsty monsters who crave human flesh and are always evil which the old mainstream media and the current media still portray them as. If you look at Therians for example, they love wolves and werewolves. If werewolves did exist, some therians won't mind being one. However, the current werewolf trend is going pretty strong. Since werewolves are not always regarded as humans being lost to control to their bestial forms and become horrific monsters and then they revert to human form if they become badly injured or dies. Instead it is the other way around, instead of reverting to human form. They revert to their 'Werewolf forms.' Well it depends on the subject, theme, and the author's portrayal of werewolves. However, I still believe that the Werewolf's true form is their werewolf form, not the human form. If all of them are like that, I think it would be boring. Blizzard's latest expansion. Cataclysm introduced two new races. The Alliance has the Worgens and the Horde has the Goblins. For Worgens in WoW, whenever they enter battle, their human forms always change into their Worgen form regardless of any type of enemy and when they die, they revert to Worgen form. Good to see Blizzard has appeal and brought in new and old werewolf fans. Since Worgen is a a cool werewolf race in Warcraft lore.
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Loupin »

DarkOriaes wrote:haha very true. Sometimes people are thinking that the true link of the whole werewolf term is coming from a human heritage. I can't place my finger on what it was called exactly, but its about how the child is covered completely in hair.

hypertrichosis

And I do believe we exist.... :P

And it's kind of like the whole "God / Devil" theory....if you believe in one...you have to believe in the other...so if we're real...what else is? And I can already read the posts of ppl askin me if I change during full moons....I kno I'm not the only one...lol :lol: Now wait don't think I split my skin and grow a tail...no nothing like that...but there are small changes...and it's painful....

:lol: And what's funny...for years I've been reading up and researching Lycanthropy...and according to everything that I've read....I have it...I have 99% of the symptoms...I should make a thread of that list and see who else ranks with me :D
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by werewolf-woman »

i would like to think that werewolves are out there.. possibly?
i like the werewolf that is a supernaturally cursed being, that undergoes a physical transformation into a wolf like creature. I like werewolves as the tragic figure that can't control transformations and is fueled by rage. i like the concept of the werewolf as the id ran wild.

i personally do not subscribe to the belief systems of Therians or otherkin, but to each their own.
i think i would be rather disappointed to find out that if werewolves exist they would be the therian type, unable to transform. I just have a notion of what a werewolf should be and would just be so bummed if they were so much less than what i had hoped.
i like the old school type of werewolf that proliferated popular culture, prior to the twilight films and the therian movement became popular.
Last edited by werewolf-woman on Mon Jan 23, 2012 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by werewolf-woman »

WolfVanZandt wrote:When people say, "Werewolf" today, they're thinking about someone that physically changes into a Wolf but in the early Middle Ages the term was applied to real people who _were thought_ to change into wolves. Whether they did or not, the term was applied to a group of real people (and still is in Eastern Europe), so except for the incovenience of people misunderstanding because they can't get around the image promoted by fictional account, the term "Werewolf" isn't inappropriate.

I don't really mind the trend toward rejecting the term in favor of the less "loaded" "Therian", unfortuantely, "Therian" is only once removed from the same problem and will soon be just as loaded and by discarding "Werewolf", there is a risk of discarding the real history behind the term, which I think would be a real loss.

while going through older posts i read this one and thought the point of view was interesting but i think the term werewolf is appropriate when discussing popular cultures view of werewolves. Werewolves of folklore myth and contemporary popular culture seem to follow a definition that includes a physical transformation. i think the term therian is more appropriate for people who feel they have a wolf spirit, or soul.

i don't really get the concept of chaning the definiton of a werewolf so you can call yourself one. i think the term werewolf should be applied to physical transformations be it into a wolf like creature or a real wolf. i think the term werewolf should not be diluted by people who desperately want to be one so they negate the meaning so they can fit into their definition of werewolf.

there are people who hate the above mentioned werewolf films and characteristics and seek to redefine what a werewolf should be.

i wasn't aware there different views on werewolves some of which deplore the beastial werewolf, which is strange to me because i really thought that was the only type of werewolves that existed in mythology and popular fiction. if there is no transformation how is the person a werewolf by the classic definition?
there are groups of people who absolutely hate werewolf transformations?
they say it is a misrepresentation of werewolves, they disavow hundreds of years of mythology and folklore and have turned werewolves int to regular people who have the soul or a werewolf. some claim that transformations are impossible. others say transformation is possible but they don't turn into raging beasts but retain their human logic and reasoning.

it seems werewolves have established mythologies and that is the standard with which a creature falls in to the category, but some people completely ignore folklore and claim that their definitions are valid. people seem to want to change the definition of a werewolf so they can try and fall in to the definition.
i think that some changes to a monster can be positive,take in films for example, like the change in zombie depictions in the new dawn of the dead film, making zombies run is super scary.
so i think that changing up some of the mythology can be positive.

i think the term werewolf does have a rich history but i think it becomes convoluted when you seek to completely redefine something that is well established just so you can include yourself in the category.

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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Silvermane »

Hmm...Part of me would like to say yes but I know that would be a fallacy of epic proportions. I always subscript to the Carl Sagan school of thought, that extraordinary claims need to be proved by equally extraordinary proof and that all good scientist believe in show me. In the past I've been approached by people, mostly on line, who claim to be real werewolves. When I flat out asked for proof, photos of shape shifting, film, etc. the gambit of excuses as to why they couldn't was extraordinary ranging from they didn't want to tell anyone (which is odd because you just did) to the outright insane idea of werewolf hunters that might come after them (these hunters employment would be insured by one thing, a lot of werewolves out there.)

Can someone actually shape shift from a human being to a wolf, or a anthromorphic looking man beast, or something akin to werewolf legends. I'd have to say no. Just too many biological issues not to mention where else in nature do we see a creature go from being one stage to another instantly. We don't, closest we get is the catapillar or other insects who lay up in a cocoon state for days, weeks, and they they emerge.

Spiritually and mentally, of course. It's why we have a mental disorder called lycanthropy to begin with, so actually mentally and spiritually believing you are a wolf or have a wolf spirit in you, sure I can say that can happen.

Therians...I've been to a few conventions where therians held panels, and it was...strange. I am all for wolf spirituality, part of my heritage is Native American and as such I can appreciate animal spirituality. That I have no issues with, but the therians claim you are born a therian, with the animal some how within you, there's no if's and's or butt's. You either are a therian or you are not, which screams elitism or selective association to me. I am not sure exactly where they stand and I think I'd rather stay confused on the issue as I simply don't get it.

So over all and probably stated a lot in this thread, I personally don't believe werewolves exist as most people think of, but is it possible? In the width and breath of the wide and expanding universe I will not rule it entirely out, but I'd need to see it to believe it.

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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Uniform Two Six »

Silvermane wrote: In the past I've been approached by people, mostly on line, who claim to be real werewolves. When I flat out asked for proof, photos of shape shifting, film, etc. the gambit of excuses as to why they couldn't was extraordinary ranging from they didn't want to tell anyone (which is odd because you just did) to the outright insane idea of werewolf hunters that might come after them (these hunters employment would be insured by one thing, a lot of werewolves out there.)
Ahem,
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Silvermane »

Uniform Two Six wrote:
Silvermane wrote: In the past I've been approached by people, mostly on line, who claim to be real werewolves. When I flat out asked for proof, photos of shape shifting, film, etc. the gambit of excuses as to why they couldn't was extraordinary ranging from they didn't want to tell anyone (which is odd because you just did) to the outright insane idea of werewolf hunters that might come after them (these hunters employment would be insured by one thing, a lot of werewolves out there.)
Ahem,
http://www.thepack.network/thepackboard ... f=2&t=3079

Enjoy.
:D
Nice and entertaining to see people have had similar experiences to my own. I was at a con that I help with Halloween in theme, were I did a werewolf panel focusing specifically on modern books, movies, and tv. I got a stand ovation when I told everyone if you claim to be a real werewolf I'd demand you shape shift to show the rest of us. Then again I got cheers when I denounced Twilight too. :)

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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Uniform Two Six »

Silvermane wrote: I got cheers when I denounced Twilight too.
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=7821

:D

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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Silvermane »

Uniform Two Six wrote:
Silvermane wrote: I got cheers when I denounced Twilight too.
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=7821

:D
The transformation sequence in that film was way too quick and I always wondered when they shifted back, where'd they get their clothes?

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Post by Trinity »

werewolf-woman wrote:
WolfVanZandt wrote:When people say, "Werewolf" today, they're thinking about someone that physically changes into a Wolf but in the early Middle Ages the term was applied to real people who _were thought_ to change into wolves. Whether they did or not, the term was applied to a group of real people (and still is in Eastern Europe), so except for the incovenience of people misunderstanding because they can't get around the image promoted by fictional account, the term "Werewolf" isn't inappropriate.

I don't really mind the trend toward rejecting the term in favor of the less "loaded" "Therian", unfortuantely, "Therian" is only once removed from the same problem and will soon be just as loaded and by discarding "Werewolf", there is a risk of discarding the real history behind the term, which I think would be a real loss.

while going through older posts i read this one and thought the point of view was interesting but i think the term werewolf is appropriate when discussing popular cultures view of werewolves. Werewolves of folklore myth and contemporary popular culture seem to follow a definition that includes a physical transformation. i think the term therian is more appropriate for people who feel they have a wolf spirit, or soul.



i don't really get the concept of chaning the definiton of a werewolf so you can call yourself one. i think the term werewolf should be applied to physical transformations be it into a wolf like creature or a real wolf. i think the term werewolf should not be diluted by people who desperately want to be one so they negate the meaning so they can fit into their definition of werewolf.
I couldn't agree more. The term werewolf has a lot of negative connotation attached to it, along with modern media hype based on what the modern movies have developed as the newer werewolf myth. With today's popular. It's the same with the term Lycanthropy, which is an honest to goodness medical term/jargon for someone who is deluded. It is a mental illness, often associated with an inability to control oneself when in such a state. Therianthropy was coined in part so as to bring the idea of an animal identity/spirituality away from the 1) lack of control, 2) Psychosis, 3) negative connotations of feral beast like behavior, etc.

There are any number of ways to "explain" what Therianthropy means. But what it boils down to is a very basic issue of self identity. Whether it is spiritual, emotional, a disassociation with one's human sense of self, what have you, it's about how an individual sees themselves.



werewolf-woman wrote: there are people who hate the above mentioned werewolf films and characteristics and seek to redefine what a werewolf should be.
These are the folks that, I myself, just shake my head at and walk away from in general. The term has been around longer then most of them have been born. I think a part of this need is that the vampire mythos has changed so drastically from the demon/bad spirit of the night into a morose, emo, tragic figure that draws human compassion. As modern society grows, the idea that is vampire changes... so too does the term werewolf evolve. Even in today's modern society what is a werewolf today is not what a werewolf was to the middle Europeans during the Dark Ages.

The idea of it /will/ evolve, but forcing the change is silly. Pun intended. ;)
werewolf-woman wrote:i wasn't aware there different views on werewolves some of which deplore the beastial werewolf, which is strange to me because i really thought that was the only type of werewolves that existed in mythology and popular fiction.
Modern myth maybe, but the werewolf myth is different depending on the author, poet, historian, or movie maker you speak with in general. I have a ton of werewolf books and movies. Some of them share the same transformation ideal, some it is a temporary curse, others take that it is a permanent change on a cell-deep level. Wolfen isn't so much of a werewolf novel as a "human hunting wolf creature" novel. Heck in some myths a vampire's soul if not laid to rest could infest the local wolf population and cause a wolf's bite to turn a human into a werewolf. (See - explain rabies in the Dark Ages sort of idea).

Werewolf is.... feral, wild, fierce. But because of modern science and study of wolves, the wolf side is no longer /as/ feared as it is more understood. The werewolf feeding on people comes from a time when they did, when winters were hard on every creature. However, now that we understand wolves better, so to does the werewolf myth shift, evolve, change, on it's own.

werewolf-woman wrote:if there is no transformation how is the person a werewolf by the classic definition?
That's just it. I think the "lack of change" may or may not come from a therian ideal of a non-shifting mentality. It's too much to go into here and now, but the base ideal is that one just /is/ a wolf on the inside. There is no eclipse of personality, there is no change of behavior. I think here is a leak from the therians pushing into modern myth. At least taht is what it seems like to me.
werewolf-woman wrote:there are groups of people who absolutely hate werewolf transformations?
Are there? :o
werewolf-woman wrote:they say it is a misrepresentation of werewolves,
I'd love to get into a debate with these sorts of folks. *evil grin*
werewolf-woman wrote: they disavow hundreds of years of mythology and folklore and have turned werewolves int to regular people who have the soul or a werewolf. some claim that transformations are impossible. others say transformation is possible but they don't turn into raging beasts but retain their human logic and reasoning. it seems werewolves have established mythologies and that is the standard with which a creature falls in to the category, but some people completely ignore folklore and claim that their definitions are valid.
Yeah, again I think this is the ideal of Therianthropy leaking into the werewolf myth ideal.
werewolf-woman wrote: people seem to want to change the definition of a werewolf so they can try and fall in to the definition.
Posers, fakes, trolls.. there are other names for such folks who try to /force/ the "human into wolf's clothing". I'm a bit bitter and jades of such folks.. can ya tell? ;)
werewolf-woman wrote:i think that some changes to a monster can be positive,take in films for example, like the change in zombie depictions in the new dawn of the dead film, making zombies run is super scary.
so i think that changing up some of the mythology can be positive.
Like the ability for a werewolf to control the change and not be controlled by the moon? Dude talk about scary. Your next door neighbor could be a werewolf and you'd NEVER know!
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Trinity »

Silvermane wrote:Hmm...Part of me would like to say yes but I know that would be a fallacy of epic proportions. I always subscript to the Carl Sagan school of thought, that extraordinary claims need to be proved by equally extraordinary proof and that all good scientist believe in show me. In the past I've been approached by people, mostly on line, who claim to be real werewolves. When I flat out asked for proof, photos of shape shifting, film, etc. the gambit of excuses as to why they couldn't was extraordinary ranging from they didn't want to tell anyone (which is odd because you just did) to the outright insane idea of werewolf hunters that might come after them (these hunters employment would be insured by one thing, a lot of werewolves out there.)
YEP! Prove it or shut it, imo. :shift:
Silvermane wrote:Can someone actually shape shift from a human being to a wolf, or a anthromorphic looking man beast, or something akin to werewolf legends. I'd have to say no. Just too many biological issues not to mention where else in nature do we see a creature go from being one stage to another instantly. We don't, closest we get is the catapillar or other insects who lay up in a cocoon state for days, weeks, and they they emerge.
Some species can change sex as the need arises and that does not take days or weeks. But never have I heard of a full out change into a different species /except/ in myth and legend.

I suppose on a quantum physics type level where the laws of a particular universe may allow for such a transformation.... I would think the ability would come at a cost (think Odo from Deep Space Nine sci-fi series). But... yeeeaaah That's a stretch.
Silvermane wrote:Spiritually and mentally, of course. It's why we have a mental disorder called lycanthropy to begin with, so actually mentally and spiritually believing you are a wolf or have a wolf spirit in you, sure I can say that can happen.

Therians...I've been to a few conventions where therians held panels, and it was...strange. I am all for wolf spirituality, part of my heritage is Native American and as such I can appreciate animal spirituality. That I have no issues with, but the therians claim you are born a therian, with the animal some how within you, there's no if's and's or butt's. You either are a therian or you are not, which screams elitism or selective association to me. I am not sure exactly where they stand and I think I'd rather stay confused on the issue as I simply don't get it.
pm me sometime if you are really interested. I've been following this phenomenon for YEARS. >.< :)

The ideal of therianthropy is not a parallel to shamanism or the like spiritual beliefs. They intersect sure, but they are not the same. There is no creation myth. There is no higher spiritual beings. It is a state of understanding oneself as being attuned to, or part of something not quite human. This is why the term was coined. To establish that Therians are by definition something "other" on the inside. It's not an elitist thing.

It's like saying the term "blond" is elitist..... I was born blond. I just am blond. I don't have to change my hair color to fit in, and in fact it's caused me more havoc with some people then I would like. Being a therian is the same idea.
Silvermane wrote:So over all and probably stated a lot in this thread, I personally don't believe werewolves exist as most people think of, but is it possible? In the width and breath of the wide and expanding universe I will not rule it entirely out, but I'd need to see it to believe it.
Yeah, not the movie-myth, historic-myth monsters, those types of werewolves don't exist imo either. I need to see it to believe it, ya know?
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by LupusDream »

i say yes. However i guess the only reason why we never seen a werewolf is because there are so may secrets in the world that are never meant to shown. just think if a werewolf were to show them selves to the human race dont you think that every human wants to be like them and then next thing we know a war breaks out or just so many bad things happen? thare are alway reasons for secrets and there are reasons why we do not know the truth to them.
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Uniform Two Six »

Silvermane wrote:The transformation sequence in that film was way too quick and I always wondered when they shifted back, where'd they get their clothes?
You had to watch sparkly vampires, and your nitpick on Twilight was the werewolves having extra sets of clothes?
:eyebrow:

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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Silvermane »

Uniform Two Six wrote:
Silvermane wrote:The transformation sequence in that film was way too quick and I always wondered when they shifted back, where'd they get their clothes?
You had to watch sparkly vampires, and your nitpick on Twilight was the werewolves having extra sets of clothes?
:eyebrow:
Sorry the rediculousness of the sparkly vampires goes without saying. My mind tends to automatically block them out. Vampires meet the sun, they turn to dust not into a disco ball. :P

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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by FoxKnight »

Silvermane wrote:
Uniform Two Six wrote:
Silvermane wrote:The transformation sequence in that film was way too quick and I always wondered when they shifted back, where'd they get their clothes?
You had to watch sparkly vampires, and your nitpick on Twilight was the werewolves having extra sets of clothes?
:eyebrow:
Sorry the rediculousness of the sparkly vampires goes without saying. My mind tends to automatically block them out. Vampires meet the sun, they turn to dust not into a disco ball. :P
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by werewolf-woman »

@ Trinity,
you are awesome. it is so nice to discuss this topic with someone who is like minded. I totally understand being jaded by the therians and wannabes. Being a werewolf fan is tough theses days, reading your post were really refreshing :D

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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Silvermane »

Silvermane wrote:So over all and probably stated a lot in this thread, I personally don't believe werewolves exist as most people think of, but is it possible? In the width and breath of the wide and expanding universe I will not rule it entirely out, but I'd need to see it to believe it.
Yeah, not the movie-myth, historic-myth monsters, those types of werewolves don't exist imo either. I need to see it to believe it, ya know?[/quote]

As Woody Harleson said in Zombieland "Put up or shut up." and that phrase pretty much summarizes my views on people who claim to be werewolves in real life. The only exception I can think of off hand to this would be someone who actually has the mental disease of lycanthropy, but that's sort of all in the head and not some teenager claiming the insane claim of p shifting.

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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by Trinity »

werewolf-woman wrote:@ Trinity,
you are awesome. it is so nice to discuss this topic with someone who is like minded. I totally understand being jaded by the therians and wannabes. Being a werewolf fan is tough theses days, reading your post were really refreshing :D
*bows*
I try. :)
:wolfpaint:
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She-wolf who stalked the forums when all else sane, slept.

werewolf-woman
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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by werewolf-woman »

Loupin wrote:
DarkOriaes wrote:haha very true. Sometimes people are thinking that the true link of the whole werewolf term is coming from a human heritage. I can't place my finger on what it was called exactly, but its about how the child is covered completely in hair.

hypertrichosis

And I do believe we exist.... :P

And it's kind of like the whole "God / Devil" theory....if you believe in one...you have to believe in the other...so if we're real...what else is? And I can already read the posts of ppl askin me if I change during full moons....I kno I'm not the only one...lol :lol: Now wait don't think I split my skin and grow a tail...no nothing like that...but there are small changes...and it's painful....

:lol: And what's funny...for years I've been reading up and researching Lycanthropy...and according to everything that I've read....I have it...I have 99% of the symptoms...I should make a thread of that list and see who else ranks with me :D

Lycanthropy is a mental illness that is marked by delusions of turning into a wolf. If you really have done research on lycanthropy you would have found that it is an actual mental illness and that with most mental disorders diagnosis should be made by a professional. if you think you do undergo transformations you might want to seek out some mental health professionals. If you truly believe you undergo some from of transformation then you might actually be right about having lycanthropy sine one of the hallmarks of the condition is auditory and visual hallucinations and delusions of transformation.

or if you don't have clinical lycanthropy then you might have a very rich fantasy life.

you are claiming to have lycanthropy, what symptoms do you present and what research have you done?

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Re: Real Werewolves, are they out there.

Post by werewolf-woman »

Zurrealizm wrote:Yes and No for me.

From a human point of view, without concrete evidence and exposure, I would firmly state that werewolves doesn't or cannot exist.

But from my point of view, why not? Just because I may not believe that werewolves exist doesn't mean I am correct. I am open and fascinated to the idea that werewolves and any other mythological creatures could exist, and it's always a good idea to keep an open mind no matter what you believe that may or may not be true.
i totally agree!

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