Anatomy nitpicking: Collarbones?

[Focrow]

Okay, with such a view of a werewolf, it works perfect.

But with the idea of a halfwolf combining and blending features of human and wolf, it doesn't make much sense, that it creates entirely new body parts.
It could do it, if the halfwolf was a species on its own. But when we see it as a transformation stage between human and wolf, there's no room to include the anatomy of other species.
Besides, the bird's wishbone (furcula) has no connection to the wing (humerus).
http://cas.bellarmine.edu/tietjen/Labor ... eleton.gif
http://www.owlpellets.com/ce/birdskel/birdskelN.gif

[Lupin]

Yup...people can do strange things with thier body.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADd7BrrEPOg

But I don't think the video above has anything to do with the collarbone. Or does it?

O_o That was really really weird.

[Rhuen]

Okay, with such a view of a werewolf, it works perfect.

But with the idea of a halfwolf combining and blending features of human and wolf, it doesn't make much sense, that it creates entirely new body parts.
It could do it, if the halfwolf was a species on its own. But when we see it as a transformation stage between human and wolf, there's no room to include the anatomy of other species.
Besides, the bird's wishbone (furcula) has no connection to the wing (humerus).
http://cas.bellarmine.edu/tietjen/Labor ... eleton.gif
http://www.owlpellets.com/ce/birdskel/birdskelN.gif

With a halfhuman/wolf that walks upright and biped when it moves to all fours with out transforming to a full wolf it ends up with a Gorilla like stance and as such is severly limited in speed and mobility.
The structure I stated is not techniquelly an actual wishbone but looks simular to one when it unhindges and re-locks for the stooped over or all fours stance to give them better mobility for those stances.
and in fact also requires an extremly flexible ribcage with tendens along the breast bone and spine not found in any living creature.

[Focrow]

Hehe, good one

[Khuwwa]

First of all: Hi, I'm new, but too boring to open an "Introductions"-thread *g*

The question, that I always ask myself, is, how much human and how much wolf should a half-wolf be? Most anthro pictures (I guess about 99%) are nothing more than a furry human body with paws and an animal's head. Doesn't make much sense to me. And I'm glad, that the movie will show better ideas.
But if my search was correct, one of the most significant differences of the torso between human and wolf hasn't been discussed, yet.

My idea is, that half-wolves shouldn't have solid collarbones like humans, because they would restrict the movement of the scapula (or shoulderblades); I envision a half-wolf to be bipedal as well as quadruped, so their scapula have to be at the back of the ribcage when they're walking on two legs, and on its side, when they're running on four legs - see bears for references.

Your ideas on this? [or maybe the link to the thread I overlooked *g*]

Yes! I completely agree as well. This was a topic that didn't seem to be addressed last time I looked at this board, and I was going to start it if it wasn't here... so anyway.
Yes, I think most depictions of anthro wolves have a torso that is too human-like, especially in comparison to the face, which usually looks exactly like a wolf's. I think the collarbone should definitely be diminished in Gestalt, and absent in full wolf form. Having only part of a collarbone would make a werewolf in Gestalt more wolfy-looking, and better able to run on all fours, while still allowing a greater range of movement like a human's arms.

I'm not feeling the groove with the wishbone, but that's probably because I like my half-wolves in the middle, halfway between wolves and humans (mostly). Although as someone said, an exactly half wolf, half human face might look a little bad. But also terrifying. And sometimes, terrifying is good... ok, I'm done now.

[psiguy]

I agree that there needs something to be done about the collar bone between human and wolf. But by NO means should there be any other animal "by-products" in the mix.

I can only imagine...

"Freeborn: A love story between a woman and somebody who is part man, part wolf, and part bird."



And therefore I conclude... Wishbones! Good for wereducks, not for werewolves.

[Khuwwa]

I agree that there needs something to be done about the collar bone between human and wolf. But by NO means should there be any other animal "by-products" in the mix.

I can only imagine...

"Freeborn: A love story between a woman and somebody who is part man, part wolf, and part bird."



And therefore I conclude... Wishbones! Good for wereducks, not for werewolves.

...yeah.

[Rhuen]

I will rephrase myself, it seems it was a mistake to compare the design to a wishbone, this seems to have caused confussion.

as complete a description as I can think of.

Picture your, collar bone, breast bone, ribcage, diaphram, shoulder blades, and where the ribs connect to the breast bone and spine.

Okay the collar bone can unhindge its self at the center where it contacts the ribcage. thus becoming loose and forming a Y shape (thus the comparison) with the breast bone, but are floating much like the shoulders of a cat are floating. The Ribs, breast bone, shoulder blades, and upper spine have extremly flexible tendens and muscles allowing for a reshapeing of the ribcage with out transformation when on all fours.
The Diaphram is also very flexible and immensly strong.
This all allows for a strong and fast quadraped but also allows it to stand up right (where the collar bone re-hindges) and work in a biped stance.

as a bonus this feature would create additional flexibility and muscle to the upper body, and an amazing lung capacity adding to the already incredible stamina of the wolf.

[Kzinistzerg]

You guys are giving me ideas... i'm really glad we have this place, it's a great resource for information!