Agent: Sir, We have situation.
Head of FBI: What is it?
Agent: We have an independent thinker, she refuse to blindly follow our regulations.
Head of FBI: Commence Black Operations, I want her cease to exist, wipe out all of her records.
Agent: Yes sir, no one will never knew she existed.
Every government degenerates when trusted to the rulers of the people alone. The people themselves are its only safe depositories. - Thomas Jefferson
That movie, and the graphic novel from which it is based, has a great message (well... part of the graphic novel's message. The other part supports anarchy).
However, I would like to point out that the point of using the poem in the story was for the sake of irony. The point of the poem is that it was totally awesome that Guy Fawkes failed, hence why it should be remembered. I don't know how much I'd agree with the point, but mainly because I know next to nothing about the actual event.
"We used to laugh at Grandpa when he'd head off and go fishing. But we wouldn't be laughing that evening when he'd come back with some w**** he picked up in town."
-Jack Handey
ravaged_warrior wrote:The point of the poem is that it was totally awesome that Guy Fawkes failed, hence why it should be remembered. I don't know how much I'd agree with the point, but mainly because I know next to nothing about the actual event.
I think its more about the fact that he TRIED.
You are the only light there is for yourself my friend
Sure, I could have stayed, could have even been king. But in my own way...I am King. (grabs girl) Hail to the king, baby!
-Ash www.knight-templar.deviantart.com
The full Guy Fawkes poem, for those who wonder how it goes beyond what V quotes:
Remember, remember the Fifth of November,
The Gunpowder Treason and Plot,
I know of no reason
Why Gunpowder Treason
Should ever be forgot.
Guy Fawkes, Guy Fawkes, t'was his intent
To blow up King and Parli'ment.
Three-score barrels of powder below
To prove old England's overthrow;
By God's providence he was catch'd
With a dark lantern and burning match.
Holloa boys, holloa boys, let the bells ring.
Holloa boys, holloa boys, God save the King!
Given how much cooler the first five lines sound alone, I can see the reason for the omission of the rest, heh.
They still celebrate the demise of the only person ever to go into Parliament with honest intentions over here... although it's always looked to me that the local version celebrates the attempt, not its failure. While (I'm told) the British version of the celebration has bonfires and effigies, the local version has skyrockets, catherine wheels, double happys, sparklers and sundry other fireworks (depending on which of the above list the Fire Service haven't managed to get banned yet...)
Personally I don't get why the Anarchist movement has adopted him as a hero, other than a shared fondness for explosives.
Guy Fawkes was a Catholic and was working with the Spanish royal family to return England to Catholicism. This is where the treason came from: England was fighting with Spain for control of the seas and House Tudor were trying to remain independent of the Hapsburgs.
Anyway, I was under the impression that Anarchism eschews religion. The Gunpowder Plot was state-sponsored terrorism and part of a religious war.
I'm sure that the V for Vendetta comic has some part in it, unless Alan Moore left that detail out of the after word for why he chose Guy Fawkes. V was an anarchist in the comic, and was taking down the government to try and create equality and fairness through a lack of power. I personally don't agree with this because I don't think it would work. Still a great graphic novel, though. I think what caught me by surprise the most was when V blew up Parliament in the beginning. After seeing the movie, that wasn't even close to what I was expecting.
"We used to laugh at Grandpa when he'd head off and go fishing. But we wouldn't be laughing that evening when he'd come back with some w**** he picked up in town."
-Jack Handey
Sure, I could have stayed, could have even been king. But in my own way...I am King. (grabs girl) Hail to the king, baby!
-Ash www.knight-templar.deviantart.com
Midnight wrote:While (I'm told) the British version of the celebration has bonfires and effigies, the local version has skyrockets, catherine wheels, double happys, sparklers and sundry other fireworks (depending on which of the above list the Fire Service haven't managed to get banned yet...)
"A penny for the guy?"
You are the only light there is for yourself my friend
Last edited by Templar on Thu Nov 08, 2007 2:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Sure, I could have stayed, could have even been king. But in my own way...I am King. (grabs girl) Hail to the king, baby!
-Ash www.knight-templar.deviantart.com
That's true, but James I was related to the House of Tudor, who started the Anglican Church (a branch of Protestantism). At the time, Spain was ruled by a branch of House Hapsburg, who were Catholic.
(I know this...Rudolph II of the Spanish Hapsburgs is regarded as one of classical European-style dressage's patron saints...)
True, but in order to find truth or lies, you must be seeking them. Believe me, I know it sucks, but perhaps you could find a more tactful way of expressing your distate.
Templar wrote:Well, that's about as long as my tolerance lasts.
Sure, I could have stayed, could have even been king. But in my own way...I am King. (grabs girl) Hail to the king, baby!
-Ash www.knight-templar.deviantart.com
Overrated? How? Don't most people... You know... Hate them?
I like them, myself. I find their music over-the-top, and their lyrics are stupid, but damn it, I like them in spite of, and possibly because of, it.
"We used to laugh at Grandpa when he'd head off and go fishing. But we wouldn't be laughing that evening when he'd come back with some w**** he picked up in town."
-Jack Handey
Thanks for the quick prompt to look at history. Most of us here in the United States have never heard of Guy Fawkes night. Quick crash course on Wikipedia and I've got some of the basics. But, I really ought to know more.
I wouldn't say it's a same he failed, not by a long shot. Remember that Oliver Cromwell not long afterwards succeded in a revolution built on the same notion of religious rule. It quickly became appearant that they were better off with a King. Monarchies are one thing. But, when you mix religion and politics, you get real holy terrors--the Taliban, the Spanish Inquisition--you get the idea. Yes, it saved an oppressive regime, but it probably prevented a far worse one and preserved history as we know it, including the British Parliament, a major institution of freedom and democracy even today.
Taking a Gestalt approach, since it's the "in" thing...
