Age

[Bowtie]

Obviously, they can't, but for the sake of the plot, they must, and they do.

At the same time, since so many people here seem to be interested in the "realism" of werewolves, we should focus on what's realistic, despite what can *not* be.

Age is one of those factors.

In that respect, I really don't see a point in living that long, personally. I can offer several "realistic BS" reasons as to why they cannot live that long. Can you offer reasons as to why they should?

One quick reason would be something I just thought of. I would imagine regeneration has to be at a *maximum* during a shapeshift because of the overwhelming stress on the body. The metabolics of a shifting werewolf have to be skyrocketing during a shift. That fact alone might shorten a werewolf's lifespan many times faster than anything a human does. If a werewolf is capable of, say, twice the lifespan of a human, but shifting burns up the body as little as twice as fast, then you're cutting the life expectancy down to that *of* a human. Of course, if that were to be set as "truth," then the oldest werewolves would be the ones who don't shift as often.

You raise a good point, Doodles, one that I hadn't thought of before. The human body changes with age. Especially the female human body - menopause, where the reproductive system pretty much shuts down, and the body changes because of a hormone imbalance.

I would think that a werewolf might go through something similar at old age. Maybe the change becomes increasingly difficult. I read elsewhere that skilled individuals can control the shift despite the phase of the moon, so they may "avoid" it. However, I would think that one day, an elder werewolf might simply *not* be able to shift any longer.

There could be several reasons for it. The change could punch up the metabolics so much that the heart or blood vessels may not be able to handle it. Thus, you have a heart attack or stroke which would probably kill the werewolf. Even if it didn't, imagine being this partially changed mess... other werewolves would definitely not to bring "it" to a hospital for obvious reasons, so they might put "it" down. After all, it wouldn't surprise me if the werewolves believed in euthanasia.

Or perhaps it just takes more and more effort to shift, and the shift takes longer and longer to perform. In that event, it would make sense that eventually a werewolf would simply *stop* shifting, and be stuck in whatever form it is in at the time.

[Figarou]

Freeborn takes place in a span of a few years. Not several hundred years. So I guess we wouldn't have to worry about the age of a werewolf while watching the film. But its good to know.

[outwarddoodles]

yes but it could have lead to an arguement.

Me:I think a werewolf can live twice as long
You: It doesnt make sense its not realistc.
Me: yeah well nethier is transforming into a wolf or galstate.

See, if you dont believe a werewolf can live alot longer than a human can, then how can you believe they can transform into something thats impossible for a human can. how can the mouth and foot grow longers, and bones arnt made to shift. see

No your switching it around. How can I beleive someone could shift into a werewolf and live like a million (or 200) years without being half decayed lump of skin connected to every machine posible?

Nad I really like what Bowtie said, age and 'werewolf menopause'. Personaly I still can't tell exactly whats going to happen to the 200 year old lump of skin connected to every machine on the full moon, posibly turn into a lump of skin and fur.


I'll see what others say.

[Jamie]

I've also gotten tired of immortal werewolves. I see it as one of the many characteristics that writers like to borrow from vampires and paste onto werewolves, and I find nearly all of those characteristics annoying.

As to aging, most of the research I've read on the subject seems to indicate that many aspects of aging are hard-wired into our DNA. Organisms are designed to age. For example, it is believed that each person has a predetermined age at which their hair will begin to go gray. Some perfectly healthy people have naturally gray hair by age 20.

Of course, if you are extremely healthy, you are much less likely to die early in the aging process, and you look better. So, with regenerative abilities, I'd expect werewolves in their 30's to look like humans in their 30's, werewolves in their 50's to look like humans in their 50's and so on, except that they would look like they were aging gracefully. There would be fewer wrinkles, they would probably retain their teeth much longer, and they would generally seem more energetic.

It would probably add at least 20 years to the average lifespan, although there could be detracting aspects that balance this out some. Perhaps the process of transformation fixes things in the short term, but also puts some long-term stresses on the body that will eventually counter its benefits. And then there are always possibilities that have already been mentioned that certain things, like cancer, might be more deadly to werewolves than to humans.

To summarize, I would expect aged werewolves to be in the top 10% of healthy people for their age group, and I might expect them to live longer, discounting accidents. However, I would not like to see any werewolf older than about 130, and I would NOT like to see 30-year-old actors passed off as 100-year-old werewolves. Perhaps a 30-year-old actor could play a werewolf in his or her early 40s, but that is about the largest difference I would want to see.

[Shadow Wulf]

Why is it that everyone in this forum is a realist? and i mean almost everyone,i see a werewolf virus as to would be like a mutation, i would prefer a werewolf to atleast look 15 years younger than what he really is, although a werewolf still remains a humans quality, but if they are able to shift they almost have to cahnge the whole structure of the human body in order to adapt. you guys see a werewolf as an animal thats half human, almost like an ape, i see it a almost mythical creature, but seeing how the looks of it all you people are in the 30s and out of college and are ethier physicians manager of another company or something. you say that that werewolfs might live shorter life span cause they will put too much stress on thier body. mabey over the years they adapt, mabey they started living short life spans at first, remember everything is evolving, i think over the years thier regenatration gets better and better, like us people become smarter and smarter. so eventually they must able to live longer than a human, i say atleast about 10% to 15% longer than any other human. and some humans have lived up to 110 years old, a really healthy werewolf should live about 130 mabey more if there lucky and yes true age will catch up to them and eventually they wont be able to TF cause the bones will be too weak to handle the punishment, that i agree. please dont take this the wrong way but mabey you guys must have lost some imagination or must not see other possiblities over the years.
and outwarddoodles mention why would you need that long to live. mmmm let me think about that, cause of people who werent given oppertunities when there were young and by the time their in their forties they know they could have live a better life if they knew about this or if they had more time they could take could try to make it to the big shots, my dad is in his 40s and he has poor retirement plan, if any. he would still have to work 20 or 30 more years before he retires and then he would be in 70s. Plus he smokes so that might cut off a few years, thats where werewolf regeneration comes in handy. but people stop comapring them to us soo much they could work much different from us. they could probaly handle the stress well and wont affect them so much as you think.
but yeah i dont believe a werewolf should live forever too, we all have an experation date.

[outwarddoodles]

and outwarddoodles mention why would you need that long to live

No, I was asking why you think they would live longer.

but seeing how the looks of it all you people are in the 30s and out of college and are ethier physicians manager of another company or something.

Actually no, I'm just a wee little 13 year old who knows some medical junk, my step Mom is getting her PH.D to be a Neuroscientist and thats what I want to be when I grow up too.

If a werewolf can adapt to be older than a human then why arn't humans adapting just like them? Yes, humans keep getting older an older, back then I would of been considered middle aged. Yet whats making them quicker to become older and older? Where does regeneration or having now different genetics paired with wolves help here?

Yes, I like my werewolves realistic. Its like a 'hobby'. One day I'm going to have so much useless werewolf knowledge about a made up virus that I'll probaly end up having to right a book to tell what a realistic werewolf would be like. Thats what this forum, 'what should a werewolf be' is about. The rest of the forums can be all about werewolves however we like but right now we are talking about what a realistic werewolf would be like.

Please, also keep your grammer up and good and your posts would be easeir to read and people would love to see it that way. Your much more intellegent when you type better. If you don't want to do that try typing in Microsoft word first and it can make changes and fixes for you sometimes.

you say that that werewolfs might live shorter life span cause they will put too much stress on thier body.

Actually yes that could be so. Truly, do you want your bones and muscles strecthed and distorted? It would be painful and very weird on the body 'causing it to act different. And theres also the mental stress on a person.

but mabey you guys must have lost some imagination or must not see other possiblities over the years.

People here have come up with many different posibilities here, just rational and more realistic ones. Doesn't mean the people here are not using their mind or imagination to come up with great solutions.

[Shadow Wulf]

you know you really remined of that lady from the movie a series of unfortunate events with the whole grammer thing: "grammer is the most important thing in the world"

and sorry that i misread your post, but to move on, like i said about evolving, "why arent humans adapting the way they are"? We are. were just slower than a werewolf would. before people would only have a lifespan of 30 or 40 years old if there lucky, now with medicines and vaccine's that boost the number up by about 50%, im no docter, so im likely to be wrong about that right there. but an average person still lives up to like what 80 years old, now we have some people that are 100...110, the longest person to live recorded in history has lived to be 122, there you go see we are evolving, some people evolve faster than others, but this process takes hundreds of years to do. i think werewolfs evolve faster than men and live up to 150 or 160 at the most. but they would look like a person of a 110 or a 120 year old man. At the age of 130 werewolfs shouldnt be able to TF.

oh and as for the critcism with the imagination, im sorry people, that was an outberst and it wasnt intentional.

[outwarddoodles]

Uninttentional critism happens.

What I'm saying is why are werewolves evolving to live longer quicker tha humans? Extra regeneration isn't going to help werewolves live all that much longer here.

[Shadow Wulf]

Uninttentional critism happens.

What I'm saying is why are werewolves evolving to live longer quicker tha humans? Extra regeneration isn't going to help werewolves live all that much longer here.

there ability to regenerate could evolve, it would probaly help them live longer. you see in the beggining of the years a werewolf could have live up to 40 years no thanks to the shifting and stress as some of you say, well evolution would helpe them adapt to there bodies, allowing the regeneration to be more effective and eventually shifting will become second nature to do over the generations, soon the body should be able to handle the stress and the bones shifting and throbbing. remember the body is an amazing thing, and its not gonna just sit there let something kill it or shorten its lifespan. the body as a strong will to live and will do anything to help it live longer.plus if the werewolf takes the medicenes that we take, that should make them live longer. there not evoling quicker, (sorry if i said that before) but there evoling more efficient than humans thanks to the adatption to the body and the regenration helps alot.

And plus heres the defintion for regeration:(biology) growth anew of lost tissue or destroyed parts or organs
positive feedback: feedback in phase with (augmenting) the input
the activity of spiritual or physical renewal
re-formation: forming again (especially with improvements or removal of defects); renewing and reconstituting

[Scott Gardener]

I'm also opting in favor of healthy human--mainly not so much for physiology sake, as longer life span can be justified--but because of character power balance. Werewolves are already empowered by being shapeshifters. Adding in immortality, and we might as well throw in lightning bolts from their hands, powers of mind control, a killer three point goal, and that crawling on the ceiling thing that all the new movies keep doing.

A double-length life span is not as bad a stretch, but I don't want to give werewolves too many perks that would make it too enticing to people other than therians. We have a hard enough time justifying any angst without getting into the same "woe is me, I'm all-powerful" that plagues the vampire community.

Outwarddoodles:

One day I'm going to have so much useless werewolf knowledge about a made up virus that I'll probaly end up having to right a book to tell what a realistic werewolf would be like....

I'll have to share with you my forthcoming text, Physiology of Lycanthropy, which I intend to be my definitive reference for lycanthropology. That way, we'll both be experts in a medical field where our patients are at least in the top 10% of the healthy population, or at worst completely immortal. Add to that that they're as far as we can tell purely ficticious. OK, let's not quit our day jobs just yet.

[outwarddoodles]

Outwarddoodles:

One day I'm going to have so much useless werewolf knowledge about a made up virus that I'll probaly end up having to right a book to tell what a realistic werewolf would be like....

I'll have to share with you my forthcoming text, Physiology of Lycanthropy, which I intend to be my definitive reference for lycanthropology. That way, we'll both be experts in a medical field where our patients are at least in the top 10% of the healthy population, or at worst completely immortal. Add to that that they're as far as we can tell purely ficticious. OK, let's not quit our day jobs just yet.

I'm too young and wouldn't know enough stuff one how a werewolf could actually work, as you may tell I still need to learn alot of science to grasp an idea. Yet if your not dead by the time I'm older and have my Ph.D in Neuroscience (or atleast I hope.) then in would be quite an interesting project I could colaborate on. Otherwise I would be interested in what you come up with now.

Now learning how to add many life years to a human, eh, we could be rich!

[Shadow Wulf]

Outwarddoodles:

I'm too young and wouldn't know enough stuff one how a werewolf could actually work, as you may tell I still need to learn alot of science to grasp an idea. Yet if your not dead by the time I'm older and have my Ph.D in Neuroscience (or atleast I hope.) then in would be quite an interesting project I could colaborate on. Otherwise I would be interested in what you come up with now.

Now learning how to add many life years to a human, eh, we could be rich!

Atlast i found a cure for cancer!! werewolf venom*injects into a cancer infected person* sideeffect includes, shifting, dizziness, mind grain, lots of pain and throbbing,and aswell a sliiiiight chance of death. but atleast you'll be cured!

[outwarddoodles]

I wouldn't know, but wouldn't the constant changing of cells make cancer more likely or posibly grow faster?

[Lupin]

I wouldn't know, but wouldn't the constant changing of cells make cancer more likely or posibly grow faster?

It could, but then werewolves might have things in place to guard against that, as part of their regenrative abilites since there is going to be a lot more cell division, and DNA gets damaged while it's replicated.

[outwarddoodles]

I wouldn't know, but wouldn't the constant changing of cells make cancer more likely or posibly grow faster?

It could, but then werewolves might have things in place to guard against that, as part of their regenrative abilites since there is going to be a lot more cell division, and DNA gets damaged while it's replicated.

I don't think the DNA is precisly formed during every shift, I'm guessing its like genetics. I have brown eyes but because my dad has blue eys (which are recessive.) I am a homozygous brown eyed person. I'm hiding a blue eye gene. I'm guessing that different genetics stay in the body but show up at different times, arg. I'm just fuzzling myself. Though its the fact that, as mentioned, the cells dividing so much that that the cancer cells are going to also.

[Lupin]

I don't think the DNA is precisly formed during every shift, I'm guessing its like genetics. I have brown eyes but because my dad has blue eys (which are recessive.)

Well every time a cell undergoes mitosis (divides) the DNA is duplicated. I figure that every time a werewolf shifts whether it be human <-> gestalt <-> wolf there's going to be a large number of cell divisions.

I am a homozygous brown eyed person. I'm hiding a blue eye gene. I'm guessing that different genetics stay in the body but show up at different times, arg. I'm just fuzzling myself. Though its the fact that, as mentioned, the cells dividing so much that that the cancer cells are going to also.

Well cancer cells are weird, and don't respond to normal triggers (otherwise they wouldn't be dividing out of control.) When the 'virus' says 'shift' the cancer cells might say 'whatever' and not do anything.

[Scott Gardener]

Lycanthropy could be oncogenic (that is, causing cancer), depending on how it works. Certainly viruses that edit existing DNA create cancer risks. My lycanthropy (the one in my stories, anyway--my real lycanthropy is just some screwy metaphysical notion thingy) works by inserting whole chromosomes rather than hacking existing DNA, though, so it shouldn't directly cause cancer through disrupting existing genes.

However, stimulating metaplasia--redesigning cells that do one thing to make them do another--would be highly oncogenic. The risks of cancer by this means would be so great in fact that lycanthropy would have to have supplimental anti-cancer genetic features. As such, lycanthropy would provide tremendous research potential to benefit the lives of people who aren't interested in becoming werewolves themselves. But, to do such research would get one step closer into the realm of genetic engineering, which scares people right now.

Not that werewolves wouldn't.