Golden Wolf on TV

[Sheba]

I saw this on TV.
Im a BIG Fan of Golden Wolf's art work

http://science.discovery.com/videos/ten ... ation.html

[MattSullivan]

Oh GOD.

This is what makes werewolf fans look like retards.

[Silverclaw]

Interesting.
Was this aired on tv?

[Sheba]

Yes it was on tv. A friend saved it on her DVR for me. There was more on the tv show tho.

[Leonca~]

I’m guessing the real names were withheld for privacy or something? Can’t remember if she ever revealed her real name. If I believed something like that there is no way I would go on TV and say it, let alone on a melodramatic looking show like that.

[Berserker]

Oh GOD.

This is what makes werewolf fans look like retards.

Somewhat agreed. There was a certain level of geekness about the whole thing that kind of reminded me of Napoleon Dynamite.

[PariahPoet]

I heart Goldie so much!
I almost got to meet her at Ren-Fair in Colorado Springs but she wasn't at her booth that day.
I did get my print though. Her art is amazing!

[lycanthropeful]

Oh GOD.

This is what makes werewolf fans look like retards.

Somewhat agreed. There was a certain level of geekness about the whole thing that kind of reminded me of Napoleon Dynamite.

Well, I'm glad I posted that "Labeling oneself a therian" thread a few days ago, because if this is what they're like, then I won't touch that label with a ten-foot pole.

Sure, maybe I'd get the urge to howl once or chase a rabbit just for spite, to see what it's like, but I tend to act like a human since I am one and leave those animalistic urges for daydreams and fantasies. Perhaps if I was out in the middle of absolutely nowhere, where I know no one would ever see me, I might be willing to act that way, but probably not.

[PariahPoet]

No need to act like we're freaks. -_-

Most of us are perfectly normal on the outside.

[lycanthropeful]

Goldie said it herself... "people treat us like freaks." You guys aren't freaks. I think we all get those urges. My initial reaction was of course, "Oh, well, that's a little weird," but as I continued to watch the video, I sort of had an appreciation for Golden Wolf being comfortable enough to go out and do those things that most people wouldn't do.

I just know that I wouldn't act that way no matter how much I wanted to, but hey, that's personal opinion. It was kind of neat yet somewhat disturbing all at once to see her little clan going out and doing that because they had a passion for it.

[Baphnedia]

All the freaks are over on my forums I'm afraid.

I remember when this came out (quite some time ago)... not sure what you'd search for to find it, but yeah. Anyone who puts their lack of inhibition from the internet and applies it to real life will be labeled whether they like it or not. Depending on how you express yourself online, it might be freak (werewolves? dragons? duckies?), bigot (from teh Internet Hate Machine), or or or or or...

As far as labels go, therian, furry, or otherwise are all extremely subjective, and one reason why I rarely use those terms anymore. 'Fan' is not that subjective, but can be an early stage of 'fanatic'.

[Terastas]

You know, there's nothing wrong with being a geek. Hell, most people are geeks in one way or another; it's only because the majority of all geeks are shallow and come up with alternative labels to try and delude themselves and each other into thinking they are not geeks that the term "geek" has the negative associations it does.

I mean that. Really, what is the "popular clique" other than a bunch of fashion geeks?

Or jocks anything more than a bunch of fitness geeks and/or sports geeks?

Hell, even the people that claim to be normal are geeks in their own right. Really, what the hell is 'normal' and why do people obsess over it?

So please, don't ever knock anyone for being a geek, because chances are you're one yourself. Some people are just more accepting of this fact than others.

[PariahPoet]

Ter- I think this is the first thing we can agree on.

[Terastas]

Ter- I think this is the first thing we can agree on.

Just the first?

*sigh* Well. . . Better than nothing I guess.

[Wselfwulf]

I'm going to have to say that's a fair good call also, about the nature of in-group mentality. It's pretty homogenous in construct, just different in content and values.

[MattSullivan]

Y know what, you guys are right. I gotta apologize for coming off so high-and-mighty. I'm just your average movie-and-tv werewolf fan. I'm not a therian or..whatever. Still it was rude of me to badmouth the people on the video.

[RedEye]

Relax, Matt...

While you may have sounded off at first, you then took the time to think things out, and grew therefrom. This is a very good thing, and rare as hens' teeth; and a great deal more valuable.

My take has always been that Therian mentality is internal, rather than external; Spiritual rather than Expostulary. Internal things are hard as heck to explain, other than as "This is how it works for me".

Like Furs, Therians have a huge amount of mis-information about them being paraded around as if it were fact; when it is anything but. You took the time to consider things, and as a result you're aware of that fact now. That is the mark of an aware mind--not a bad thing to have.

You're definitely smarter than the average bear...

[Morkulv]

Oh GOD.

This is what makes werewolf fans look like retards.

Agreed. I actually saw Goldenwolf on TV a loooong time ago, but its still very silly if you ask me. The whole therianthropy concept is just completely blown out of proportion if you ask me, and the therians that I've met had a serious problem with backing any of their believes up. But thats just my experience.

[Berserker]

My take has always been that Therian mentality is internal, rather than external; Spiritual rather than Expostulary. Internal things are hard as heck to explain, other than as "This is how it works for me".

Like Furs, Therians have a huge amount of mis-information about them being paraded around as if it were fact; when it is anything but. You took the time to consider things, and as a result you're aware of that fact now. That is the mark of an aware mind--not a bad thing to have.

Therianthropy, like any other kind of new age spirituality, has large obstacles in the way of being fully understood (or taken seriously) by people on the outside. I've already talked about it in several threads, but I'll try and explain some of those obstacles here, in the hopes that other posters can understand why people like Morkulv would treat it with disdain.

First of all, its a spiritual belief which became popular on the Internet, and that lowers its believability due solely to the anonymity of said Internet.

Because it arose from the highly social environment of internet sub-culture, it quickly became associated with other social groups, to the point where it's identity was even further muddled. "Is it a furry thing? Is it a roleplaying thing? What is it?" Asks the uninformed.

This is especially problematic for therianthropy, because once a purely spiritual belief adopts the concepts of being a "social outlet," it becomes pseudo-spiritual, turning into an object of ridicule from the outside. (Since the belief would seem, at this point, to be something less than fully genuine.)

Further complicating therianthropy's situation is the fact that it is a spiritual belief with no gurus. No one can say "I'm an ultimate authority on this belief," because the tenets and experiences of that belief are widely varying. New adherents have to teach themselves their own meaning, and they are often led down diverse and sometimes contradictory paths as a result.

Speaking of widely varying, therianthropy has a hard time finding common ground among it's adherents other than the basic idea that it has to do with animals. As a result, people looking for real answers about the belief come away either confused, empty-handed, or cynical. Add to the fact that a great portion of Internet-born therians are quirky, "geeky," socially eccentric, or even inept, and people from the outside run a high chance of becoming frustrated by interacting with them.

Like Morkulv here.

Combine all these factors, and the result is a belief that gets treated with disdain, is difficult to defend, and which unfortunately butts heads with the topic that all of us here enjoy--werewolves.

I am not spreading hate, and I'd like to think that what I'm saying here is not misinformed. I'm just trying to explain why therianthropy has become what it has become.

[PariahPoet]

Berserker, I really like your approach..
There is no way to "prove" any kind of spiritual belief.
I've always told my friends that I don't mind if they don't believe in therianthropy, I just ask that they accept that it is real to me. ^^
I know what I am even if I can't show it to anybody. I also understand that it's one of those things one can't truly understand without experiencing, so it is unreasonable to expect people who are not affected by it to blindly accept it.

[Morkulv]

[Berserker]

if you pose a question about his/her believes you usually get a agressive reaction.

Well, what's your question? I'm sure some of the therians on this board, like PariahPoet, would be more than happy to answer it to the best of their ability.

Or maybe you should send a PM if you're that curious?

Sure, there are kids in the online therian community that probably haven't thought out their own beliefs for themselves, and so they get easily shot down when confronted about it. That goes for nearly every community, especially ones loosely based on an ideology. However, aggressive questions get aggressive reactions. If it looks like you're publicly trying to "bait" someone into a response that you can tear down, then yeah, the results will be poor.

[MattSullivan]

I think what my initial gripe and any subsequent agreements boil down to this. There are people who enjoy certain topics, in this case werewolves, who see other people with the same interest taking it to what they may feel is an unhealthy or embarrassing lengths.

Some fans may hear this and think "Well what makes you so friggin high and mighty? What gives you the right to criticize the behavior of others?"The answer is nothing. Nothing. We're really no better than anyone else. But I can give you an example from my own point of view.

It's the most extreme behavior that gets all the attention.

People see videos like this and assume ANYONE who likes werewolves is like that. I have always liked critters. That includes animals, toons, anthropomorphic animals, dragons, fantasy creatures...you get the point. I USED to just sit and draw this stuff willy-nilly in my teen years. Then I went to college ( animation school ) and some upper classmen quip "So, you like furry art eh?"

I blinked. Furry WHA? This was 1991. The internet barely existed. NOBODY KNEW WHAT A FURRY WAS. I sure didn't.

I'm taken to a cubicle and told stories. Horrible stories about big fat hairy men who dress up in costumes and do...deviant acts inside hotel elevators. The way they described it, these were walking, talking poster boys for what you really don't want to be associated with. As if that wasn't enough, there were a few notorious furries who liked to stalk the halls of CalArts ( my school ) and if they saw ANY animal drawings tacked up, they would find their way to the artist who drew it and "introduce themselves" as a means to "recruit"

Turns out I was one of those artists they approached.

They told me they liked my art. I beamed with pride. A compliment! How glorious! They offered to show me their own work. I said "sure". After all, what could it hurt?

Hard...core...Disney and Bluth pornography.

I was shocked. So shocked and appalled that all I was able to muster was "You guys sure can draw". These guys were also in their fifties! I was nineteen and something about the whole situation felt really gross. After they left I ran downstairs, removed my art from the display walls, and cowered in my cubicle. I was thoroughly embarrassed, thinking "all this time people have seen me as one of these furries." It damn near wrecked all the self confidence I'd built up and left me unable to draw the things I once enjoyed. I almost didn't write my werewolf movie script for the same reason.

Now I know not everyone is as sensitive as I was but the point is behavior leaves an impression. I barely draw anything critter or monster related anymore. And even if I do I hide it, lest someone think "furry!" Nowadays, if you say werewolf you're almost CERTAIN to have someone say "oh, furry stuff", having loped werewolf fans in the with more extreme members of furry fandom. THAT is where the criticism of certain behavior comes from. Not hatred or a feeling of superiority, but from a fear that we'll all be judged as one.

My two cents.

[JoshuaMadoc]

So.... You let that one incident scar you for the rest of your life?

If so, I'm very appaled. I've had countless revelations that the furries I so vowed to defend so many years ago had serious Mogadishu issues between each other. Sure I got bitter, but I also got wiser.

[MattSullivan]

It's not just that incident. I didn't want to be perceived as a furry because of my job. I know of many people who have been fired from their jobs for being associated with furry fandom.

I'd rather stay employed.