Hurricane!! Gah!!

Lupin · Post by **Lupin** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 11:25 am

vrikasatma wrote:We haven't been keeping scientific records for very long, in comparison to the planet (or even the species). How do we know what the weather patterns were like 1000 years ago?

It's even worse than that. IIRC, we only have complete data on hurricane activity in the atlantic since the 60's

AlphaOokami · Post by **AlphaOokami** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 6:39 pm

But still, whos to say global warming is NOT playing a factor? It's true that, compared to the Earth's immense population (speaking of humans here) a very, very small amount of people are even trying to help with this problem. Take, for example, Australia. It's way south of the equator, but experiences high temperatures at odd times. Kakadu is way up in the 80s, 90s, while Sydney is down in the 60s, 70s. Why? It's been proven that the ozone layer above the continent is significantly thinner than the surrounding. Proves too little is being done too late.

See? I can be scientific, too.

Lupin · Post by **Lupin** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 6:44 pm

AlphaOokami wrote: Kakadu is way up in the 80s, 90s, while Sydney is down in the 60s, 70s. Why? It's been proven that the ozone layer above the continent is significantly thinner than the surrounding. Proves too little is being done too late.

The ozone layer has nothing to do with heating. The ozone layer blocks short UV from reaching the ground.

AlphaOokami · Post by **AlphaOokami** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 6:59 pm

And what does UV do?

Maybe I meant the greenhouse effect... Heheh, got my arguments mixed up... Well, anyway, you can get really bad sunburns in Australia no matter the season or temperature due to the thinning ozone layer. ^^

And whos to say the greenhouse effect isn't helping to heat up the oceans and melt the polar ice caps?!?! Are you all just waiting for The Day After Tomorrow to become reality?

Hehe, see, I can exadgerate, too! (Not sure what <-that has to do with this forum nor do I know if I spelled the underlined word right...)

Lupin · Post by **Lupin** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 7:01 pm

AlphaOokami wrote:And what does UV do?

Short UV causes skin damage and cancer. It's the reason why people tan when they're out in the sun.

Short UV is also great for disinfecting things.

vrikasatma · Post by **vrikasatma** » Sat Oct 22, 2005 7:07 pm

Lupin wrote: IIRC, we only have complete data on hurricane activity in the atlantic since the 60's

My point exactly. The cycle we're seeing now may have happened before, but we weren't keeping records. I cite the hurricane that wiped out Galveston a hundred years ago: 8,000 dead. Back in 1905, America was what we refer to as a "Third World" country today, for all intents and purposes, and there were a lot less of us. Heck, we were Third World in the '30s, too, well into the Industrial Age. (Then again, they didn't have the clean air and water requirements we do today)

I'm not discounting the theory of global warming but we don't have convincing evidence either way, so it's a case of "your guess is as good as mine." The hole in the ozone may be cyclical. I do agree that we should pare back on the overpopulation, focus on a sustainable instead of growth economy and work towards more efficiency in all things, but that's from a straight-ahead pragmatic viewpoint.

Set · Post by **Set** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 11:09 am

Curan, you completely lost me with the "circle of carbon" thing. I've never heard of that before, not from scientists, not in books, not from geologists...so what in Ra's name are you talking about?

A single volcano puts out more pollution in one eruption than the entirety of the human race does in a year. We still have our ozone. Chill, man.

The earth has had several "cold" periods (ice ages), and several "warm" ones. Everything in nature, at least to a certain extent, is cyclical. The earth freezes, the earth thaws out. It's a natural phenomenon. In case you're wondering we're going towards a warmer age now. It has nothing to do with the ozone or anything. It's just the way the earth has been for millions of years.

Oh, and the water in the Gulf of Mexico is actually colder than the rest of the ocean. That's why Wilma is going to lose its intensity.

Jamie · Post by **Jamie** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 3:58 pm

Reilune wrote:

Curan, you completely lost me with the "circle of carbon" thing. I've never heard of that before, not from scientists, not in books, not from geologists...so what in Ra's name are you talking about?

See The Carbon Cycle. It's what eventually killed Mars, but for very different reasons. If you want to understand why environmentalism is important to the survival of the human species, it's important to understand the Carbon Cycle.

Reilune wrote:
A single volcano puts out more pollution in one eruption than the entirety of the human race does in a year. We still have our ozone. Chill, man.

True, but nevertheless these facts are misleading. Most volcanoes don't do this, only the really nasty ones, which are infrequent. Furthermore, when nasty volcanoes do this, it messes with our climate in a measurable, proven and annoying way, so we don't want to add on to these effects ourselves year-round. The ozone is still here, but VERY thin and absent in some places (luckily, the only outright hole is now over Antarctica) which is very bad, unless you like skin cancer. Futhermore, volcanoes put out a very different mix of pollutants than human activities do, and these pollutants are distributed in a different manner. The earth is more easily able to deal with the outpourings of volcanoes than the outpourings of our factory smokestacks.

Reilune wrote:
The earth has had several "cold" periods (ice ages), and several "warm" ones. Everything in nature, at least to a certain extent, is cyclical. The earth freezes, the earth thaws out. It's a natural phenomenon. In case you're wondering we're going towards a warmer age now. It has nothing to do with the ozone or anything. It's just the way the earth has been for millions of years.

Actually, we are changing climate at what is widely believed to be an unprecedented rate. Yes, the earth goes through super-tropical periods and snowball periods, but when it changes suddenly, all heck breaks loose. And now, it is changing more suddenly than has probably ever happened. This is not in dispute among respected scientists. Nor is the fact that we are contributing to it in dispute. The only thing that mainstream scientists still argue about is how much of it is directly our fault, how long it will be until things get really bad (next decade or next century) and whether it can be reversed.

Scott Gardener · Post by **Scott Gardener** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 6:34 pm

The Earth has indeed have several mass extinctions. The worst was not the one that killed the dinosaurs, but the one that cleared the way for them to evolve. Nearly 95% of all kinds of life in land and sea alike was killed at the end of the Permian. It is believed to have happened from a combination of a basalt eruption--a massive group of volcanos--and the release of toxic gases from the oceans, though it's only the lead of many working theories.

My point being, yes, mass extinctions have happened. But, that doesn't mean we want another one now.

Curan · Post by **Curan** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 7:12 pm

Reilune wrote:

Curan, you completely lost me with the "circle of carbon" thing. I've never heard of that before, not from scientists, not in books, not from geologists...so what in Ra's name are you talking about?

You can find this in schoolbooks handling the topic of ecology. We learned that in grammer school. Perhaps you have a different designation for this in english. Sometimes I translate word for word from german into english. And this is causing confusion sometimes. That's the evil of thinking in german and then translating to english. I'm sorry for this. But I'm working on it

Perhaps carbon cycle is the right designation.

Reilune wrote: A single volcano puts out more pollution in one eruption than the entirety of the human race does in a year. We still have our ozone. Chill, man.

It's a matter of largeness of the vulcano and the quantity of its pollution. But ok, this point goes to you.

Reilune wrote: The earth has had several "cold" periods (ice ages), and several "warm" ones. Everything in nature, at least to a certain extent, is cyclical. The earth freezes, the earth thaws out. It's a natural phenomenon. In case you're wondering we're going towards a warmer age now. It has nothing to do with the ozone or anything. It's just the way the earth has been for millions of years.

Agreed, but not completely. Who are we that we can assert the actual phasis of temperature rising were a result of natural cycles without having an evidence for that because we don't like the consequences which the possibility of being not a phenomenom of a natural cycle imply?

Oh ... I just see, Jamie has already answert. So I haven't to continue with my remarks.

Shadow Wulf · Post by **Shadow Wulf** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 8:26 pm

Anyone watching the news? Its possible that my area to get a power outage which is always standard procedure with hurricanes

. Anyway my dog blue knows the hurricane is coming aswell.....he's shaking right underneath me. We might go to one of my moms annoying friends house....personaly I would like to stay put in my own house....but if some of MY friends have power when I dont.....Ill be rushing over thier.

Fenrir · Post by **Fenrir** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 9:10 pm

Curan wrote: Perhaps carbon cycle is the right designation.

You know you might just have something there,

but here is a picture of the carbon cycle for Reilune

Lupin · Post by **Lupin** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 9:13 pm

Fenrir wrote:
Curan wrote: Perhaps carbon cycle is the right designation.
You know you might just have something there,

but here is a picture of the carbon cycle for Reilune

The link to the big image might help:

http://img474.imageshack.us/img474/2809 ... cle1mt.jpg

Shadow Wulf · Post by **Shadow Wulf** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 9:19 pm

And this is why we should you corn starch for our cars.

Lupin · Post by **Lupin** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 9:22 pm

What

Burning that would also release carbon dioxide

Shadow Wulf · Post by **Shadow Wulf** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 9:24 pm

you know that corn liquid that can be made into fuel.

vrikasatma · Post by **vrikasatma** » Sun Oct 23, 2005 9:38 pm

Ethyl.

Bio-diesel?

Set · Post by **Set** » Mon Oct 24, 2005 12:41 pm

You all seem so worried about this. Seems to me like you're worrying about another Y2K. You remember what happened right? Nothing. I think you guys need to relax.

I'm not worried about this at all. The earth can fix itself. Unfortunately for the human race that "fixing" will probably be in the form of natural disasters, but the earth is more than capable of taking care of itself. I'd be more worried about human overpopulation, which is a much more real and immediate threat that's also possibly contributing to the global warming...eh, problem. Wanna cut down on pollution? Stop screwing like rabbits. Less people = less pollution.

Seriously...and the world is supposedly gonna end on December 21-22, 2012 anyway. At least according to a book called The Orion Prophecy. And there's...oooh, a bunch of numbers in it!

Feh. You all sound like Chicken Little. "The sky is falling, the sky is falling!" The only thing falling out of that sky is a duck aimed right at your heads.

:wetwolf4:

Shadow Wulf · Post by **Shadow Wulf** » Mon Oct 24, 2005 12:56 pm

Im actually worried about fuel....

Short Tail · Post by **Short Tail** » Mon Oct 24, 2005 1:39 pm

Reilune wrote:Seriously...and the world is supposedly gonna end on December 21-22, 2012 anyway. At least according to a book called The Orion Prophecy.

The Aztec calendar points to December 12th 2012 as the end of the world, which is also the date that Scott Gardener makes a little announcement on the news in his book. (that was planned right

)
And if you aren’t worried about volcanoes, just wait till the Yellow Stone Volcano goes off again. It will make Katrina’s damage look like nothing. (Killing most of the people in the mid western states and depositing around 2 feet of ash all across the plains states. I plan on using it if I can ever come up with an idea for a story that it could work into. (And if I remember right, it is past due on erupting. *crosses fingers and hopes that it doesn’t happen for a long time*)

Set · Post by **Set** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 3:10 pm

Yellowstone is not past due. The eruptions are in a pattern, yes, but that doesn't mean an exact date can be calculated. It could go off tomorrow...or over 1000 years from now. Anywhere in that time frame would be normal for it.

Fuel eh? Now there's something that's actually a valid concern. It will run out eventually so the sooner people look for alternatives to oil and gasoline the better. It does no good to just complain about a problem though, you have to try and fix it.

Miguel · Post by **Miguel** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 3:43 pm

I personally don't worry about the world ending because 2000 was supposed to be the end and it wasn't. I don't see any point of it happening in 2012. Yes I am Christian. So I don't see any reason but that isn't my choice.

Curan · Post by **Curan** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 3:45 pm

In the news I heared that the power of the hurricane has been rosen over the gulf of mexico. There is spoken about a mass of damage in Florida this hurricane already did.

I hope all of you are fine by now who are living there. And I hope you haven't lost anything like a lot of people actually do.

At Reilune:
It's never wrong to have concerns about our envirenment in which we are living. Sure, you can close your eyes and you can use up all ressources hoping all will be fine and won't cause any consequences.
But I think this would be the wrong way.

vrikasatma · Post by **vrikasatma** » Tue Nov 01, 2005 6:03 pm

Reilune: We have alternatives to fossil fuels. They need only to be implemented and proliferate. To proliferate, they need to come down in price. Hydrocell cars are among us, but they cost more than Range Rovers. How many people do you know that can swing a $92,000 sticker price? Even if you totted up all the gas bought in 20 years of owning a vehicle, you still wouldn't break even. If they had hydrocell SUVs for a competitive price with internal combustion engines, you bet I'd nab me one.

AlphaOokami · Post by **AlphaOokami** » Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:30 pm

I live!! Only just got my power back this Friday. I almost went through my video game collection, kissing every one, which would have been slightly unpleasent considering the fact that some are dusty.

You don't know the meaning of the word bored until you're trapped in your house with nothing to do because you and about a million homes and businesses within at least a ten-mile radius are without power...

And the freezing showers...