Immunity

[Fenrir]

Would some people have immunity to the werewolf virus, and if so how would they have gotten it. If you think why would people have a natural immunity I give you this example 10% of people were immune to the black plague and it was not from prior exposure, would it be that the bodies natural immune system would be more "evolved" in some people then others?

[Kirk Hammett]

I posted something on Evolution but no one replied

I think yeah some people could be immune, but only if they had past family members with it or something. Like breeding on, but then, would they then have the new genetic makeup...so yes and no I guess. I could muse on this for a while.

[Renorei]

I voted 'no'. I'm not real sure on the science here, but immunity to lycanthropy just doesn't feel right to me.

Also, immunity to various different ailments is naturally selected for, becuase those who are immune live and those who aren't die. But, with lycanthropy, you don't die if you get it (well, not usually, anyway), so immunity to lycanthropy would not be selected for.

[garouda]

Hmmm,

Statistically, compared to other diseases and human populations, then perhaps.

But, still, this is something where the writer has the opportunity to be creative for the sake of storytelling.

[Terastas]

Sure. Most everything transmitted via infection can be subject to allergic reactions and/or immunities. I can think of a few ways it might work.

1) Way back in the early days of the Pack, we were discussing how the virus might have survived all these years and I threw out the possibility that lycanthropy could be widespread, but only becomes active under certain conditions. The only thing I really had to back up this argument was the fact that it might make for a good plot element.

2) In the discussion on werewolf reproduction, it's been suggested that lycanthropy can be transmitted via birth but only becomes active around the age of puberty. This same hypothesis was extended to explain the variations of lycanthropy; if bitten, you inherit the biter's form, but if born with, you inherit a dormant form that may differ from that of your parents upon maturity. It was also theorized that if two contrasting forms of lycanthropy were introduced into the body, the one that transmitted into the body first would be the dominant form.

Going back onto the puberty discussion, you could also argue that if an adolescent infects another, the bite victim inherits a dormant form of lycanthropy. And going back on the contrasting forms discussion, if he is bitten later, his dormant lycanthropy (which will stay dormant because he is beyond puberty) will overcome the mature lycanthropy.

Put all those together and you have the lycanthropy vaccine.

[Figarou]

Would some people have immunity to the werewolf virus, and if so how would they have gotten it. If you think why would people have a natural immunity I give you this example 10% of people were immune to the black plague and it was not from prior exposure, would it be that the bodies natural immune system would be more "evolved" in some people then others?

hmmmmm....I remember asking this type of question.

http://calypso-blue.com/werewolf/viewto ... 4816#14816

[Kirk Hammett]

I voted 'no'. I'm not real sure on the science here, but immunity to lycanthropy just doesn't feel right to me.

Also, immunity to various different ailments is naturally selected for, becuase those who are immune live and those who aren't die. But, with lycanthropy, you don't die if you get it (well, not usually, anyway), so immunity to lycanthropy would not be selected for.

Yeah I was thinking the same thing...if they didn't die from it, could it be selected.

But what about mutation. Evolution works through that as well, and selections favour those that survive best; the environment doesn't specifically change the organism, the organism with the best adaptations is able to live and reproduce and exaggerate the characteristic. So in saying this, maybe it could be immunity if it was a mutation involved, but I agree, would it BE selected? In human populations, lycanthopes may be able to hide and not die out, and 'selection pressures' might not work efficiently enough to eradicate them so they live on another day to reproduce.

Eh Im confusing myself now!!! Im musing haha! I havent come to any conclusions!

[Morkulv]

I think not.

[Fenrir]

Would some people have immunity to the werewolf virus, and if so how would they have gotten it. If you think why would people have a natural immunity I give you this example 10% of people were immune to the black plague and it was not from prior exposure, would it be that the bodies natural immune system would be more "evolved" in some people then others?

hmmmmm....I remember asking this type of question.

http://calypso-blue.com/werewolf/viewto ... 4816#14816

Wow you asked a lot of questions there Figarou

[Lupin]

Also, immunity to various different ailments is naturally selected for, becuase those who are immune live and those who aren't die. But, with lycanthropy, you don't die if you get it (well, not usually, anyway), so immunity to lycanthropy would not be selected for.

It might pop up occationally, but I doubt it would be part of the general population.

It might also be that the changes necessary in order to provide immunity would reduce the general fitness of a person in other aspects.

[Set]

Immunity? It might make for an interesting story, but I'd have to say no.

[CrewWolf]

Honestly, I can't see why not. It'd be rare, but I think it'd be possible for a person to be immune. Or perhaps in some way a person will still catch the werewolf bug but for some reason it just goes dormant in their body so that they will never truly experience the werewolf effects but could still pass it on somehow. Now it's starting to sound like HIV though...

And then many years after contracting it, the person undergoes some dramatic trauma which activates the latent lycanthrope within them! Man, that'd make a story...

[Renorei]

I have a question for people who know the answer. I think that if we can find the answer to this question, it will give us the answer to the question posed.

Are there any people in the world who have a natural immunity to viruses like Herpes and HIV (these are the only real viruses I can think of at the moment)? If so, then we can safely assume that some people might be immune to lycanthropy (though admittedly far fewer, because of the lack of natural selection). But if nobody is immune to such viruses, then we can assume there'd be no immunity to lycanthropy. You don't necessarily have to think only in terms of Herpes and HIV, think of any virus (but, make sure it's a virus...a lot of people here seem to be confusing viruses and bacterial illnesses) and if you can prove that there are people with a natural immunity to it (i.e. posting a link to an article or something), then this question is answered. If we can prove that there actually are people who can have natural immunity to viruses (NOT bacterial illnesses), then we've proven that immunity to lycanthropy is possible...though still highly unlikely.

[CrewWolf]

Two women found with HIV-immune mutant gene

[Renorei]

Two women found with HIV-immune mutant gene

Woah.

Well, I'm sold. If it's possible for someone to have a genetic mutation that makes them immune to HIV, then I think it's possible for a genetic mutation to exist that would make them immune to lycanthropy. It would still be really really unlikely and it wouldn't be selected for in natural selection, but it could probably still nonetheless occur. Heh, sucks for them.

[Shadow Wulf]

Wow, this reminds me. Has anyone ever read Parasite Eve or played the game, thiers a parasite that infected humans millions of years ago and in 1997 they started to act up and killing people, this one women was the only one whos immune to the parasite.

[Jamie]

I voted 'no'. I'm not real sure on the science here, but immunity to lycanthropy just doesn't feel right to me.

Also, immunity to various different ailments is naturally selected for, becuase those who are immune live and those who aren't die. But, with lycanthropy, you don't die if you get it (well, not usually, anyway), so immunity to lycanthropy would not be selected for.

Regardless of whether something is selected for or not, you can pick just about any virus or bacteria and there are generally some people who are naturally immune. It is something that happens because of the different genetic make-up of people. Let's say that the virus uses a particular protein to dock with cells, and some people have a protein on the surface of their cells that interferes with the protein that the virus uses. Those people can't be infected because whatever viruses get inside their body can't increase in number or do anything to their cells. So, in theory, there is nothing wrong with the idea that some people would be naturally immune to a lycanthropy virus. You just wouldn't have large numbers of such immune people without a good reason. Furthermore, the few naturally immune people might be extremely rare, and it would be unusual for them to ever become aware of their condition.
However, if there were some way of testing for this immunity, then such people would be top choices as werewolf hunters in a universe where organizations hunted down werewolves. Otherwise, all your hunters would be likely to join the other side sooner or later.

[Renorei]

I voted 'no'. I'm not real sure on the science here, but immunity to lycanthropy just doesn't feel right to me.

Also, immunity to various different ailments is naturally selected for, becuase those who are immune live and those who aren't die. But, with lycanthropy, you don't die if you get it (well, not usually, anyway), so immunity to lycanthropy would not be selected for.

Regardless of whether something is selected for or not, you can pick just about any virus or bacteria and there are generally some people who are naturally immune. It is something that happens because of the different genetic make-up of people. Let's say that the virus uses a particular protein to dock with cells, and some people have a protein on the surface of their cells that interferes with the protein that the virus uses. Those people can't be infected because whatever viruses get inside their body can't increase in number or do anything to their cells. So, in theory, there is nothing wrong with the idea that some people would be naturally immune to a lycanthropy virus. You just wouldn't have large numbers of such immune people without a good reason. Furthermore, the few naturally immune people might be extremely rare, and it would be unusual for them to ever become aware of their condition.
However, if there were some way of testing for this immunity, then such people would be top choices as werewolf hunters in a universe where organizations hunted down werewolves. Otherwise, all your hunters would be likely to join the other side sooner or later.

I take it you missed my most recent post.

[Aki]

I'd say it might exist, but would be rare. It'd make a real fun story element.
Especially if the immune person wants to be a Werewolf. And it'd make a useful tool for hunters or hunter wannabes, so they could hunt werewolves without managing to keep uninfected by luck or something. Make a sort of Lycanthropy immunization shot or something...

Though, the immune guy wanting to be a WW is a more interesting story-hook...

[garouda]

HOWEVER

If, as there likely are, there are different strains of the werewolf virus, then a so called 'immune' werewolf hunter, might just find he has rolled the dice once too often if he continues to hunt werewolves.

The virus only has to beat him ONCE. He has to beat it EVERY SINGLE time.

[Aki]

HOWEVER

If, as there likely are, there are different strains of the werewolf virus, then a so called 'immune' werewolf hunter, might just find he has rolled the dice once too often if he continues to hunt werewolves.

The virus only has to beat him ONCE. He has to beat it EVERY SINGLE time.

True. But hey - smart hunters will avoid letting the wolf get the chance to bite him, and smarter ones with wear armor to turn aside bites/slashes if a wolf gets too close.

Though, really, a shotgun at close range drops anything, or knocks it back a distance otherwise. This means you have a good chance of keeping uninfected without the immunity.

Even if you have the one immunity, your chances increase dramatically.

[garouda]

HOWEVER

If, as there likely are, there are different strains of the werewolf virus, then a so called 'immune' werewolf hunter, might just find he has rolled the dice once too often if he continues to hunt werewolves.

The virus only has to beat him ONCE. He has to beat it EVERY SINGLE time.

True. But hey - smart hunters will avoid letting the wolf get the chance to bite him, and smarter ones with wear armor to turn aside bites/slashes if a wolf gets too close.

Though, really, a shotgun at close range drops anything, or knocks it back a distance otherwise. This means you have a good chance of keeping uninfected without the immunity.

Even if you have the one immunity, your chances increase dramatically.

Armor ?

Modern Body armor like Kevlar, is not good against pointy penetrating objects, like ice picks ..... or long teeth.

Also folks familiar with different types of armor, know that it has LOTS of weaknesses.

AND

Have you ever heard the line. You never hear the bullet that gets you ?

WW hunters are not mystic gods, or supermen. They are just men.

[Aki]

HOWEVER

If, as there likely are, there are different strains of the werewolf virus, then a so called 'immune' werewolf hunter, might just find he has rolled the dice once too often if he continues to hunt werewolves.

The virus only has to beat him ONCE. He has to beat it EVERY SINGLE time.

True. But hey - smart hunters will avoid letting the wolf get the chance to bite him, and smarter ones with wear armor to turn aside bites/slashes if a wolf gets too close.

Though, really, a shotgun at close range drops anything, or knocks it back a distance otherwise. This means you have a good chance of keeping uninfected without the immunity.

Even if you have the one immunity, your chances increase dramatically.

Armor ?

Modern Body armor like Kevlar, is not good against pointy penetrating objects, like ice picks ..... or long teeth.

Also folks familiar with different types of armor, know that it has LOTS of weaknesses.

AND

Have you ever heard the line. You never hear the bullet that gets you ?

WW hunters are not mystic gods, or supermen. They are just men.

Not Kevlar. Kevlar can stop high speed objects, but not slow moving (well, compartively) ones, apparently. A sort of higher-tech platemail. Sorta like what Marines in the Halo Games wear. It'd stop pointy penetrating objects, and slashing ones.

I suggested the shotgun for when the WW closes in. One should do his best to keep his distance until, but I am pointing out that even then they can still fend off a WW, who would be skilled in close range.

And while a WW hunter is a man, he is a Werewolf Hunter. If he's got experience, he'll be deadly, as he's fought and killed things ordinary men haven't and couldn't.

[Fenrir]

Not Kevlar. Kevlar can stop high speed objects, but not slow moving (well, compartively) ones, apparently. A sort of higher-tech platemail. Sorta like what Marines in the Halo Games wear. It'd stop pointy penetrating objects, and slashing ones.

I suggested the shotgun for when the WW closes in. One should do his best to keep his distance until, but I am pointing out that even then they can still fend off a WW, who would be skilled in close range.

And while a WW hunter is a man, he is a Werewolf Hunter. If he's got experience, he'll be deadly, as he's fought and killed things ordinary men haven't and couldn't.

The master chief armor (Mjolnir) or the regular marines

[garouda]

Remember my quip about the bullet you don't hear ?

We're not talking video games or hard to beat bosses.

We are talking about the kind of armor that IS available in the real world.

And remember, that the typical werewolf is nearly brain dead as shown in games. Like shooting fish in a barrel.

No

Let's talk about savy werewolves. With shotguns and 30.06 rifles of their own.

Oh, and smarts too.

Not to mention teeth and an infectious agent.