Anatomy

redwolfmoon · Post by **redwolfmoon** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 12:35 pm

I'm new here, so I'm sorry if this is in the wrong place. When I found the site, I really wanted to draw something, and this is what I made, it might be interesting for those of you discussing anatomy. Right now I only have skeletal structure finished.

http://www.deviantart.com/view/35068750/

Vuldari · Post by **Vuldari** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 1:36 pm

WOW! Very Nice. I like that alot. Your art style looks so refined in this picture, and your representation of "lycan" bonestructure looks very convincing and anatomically feasable
(We call that bi-ped-able form "Gestalt" around here, meaning a prime combination of different features, greater than the sum of its parts, vs a Full Ferral Wolf form)

BTW: ART generally goes in "The Creative Den" section, unless you have some perticular points about this skeleton you wish to start a discussion about.

That is a very impressive first post redwolfmoon.

I higly reccomend that you visit the "Introductions" thread so we can all greet you properly.

Lukas · Post by **Lukas** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 3:14 pm

i was thinking that but i didnt bother to post it untel someone else did

Figarou · Post by **Figarou** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 3:47 pm

Ummmm......The foot anatomy looks confusing.

Take a good look at picture redwolfmoon provided.

See the one standing upright? I see 5 claws/toes. Other artists draw 4 toes/claws with or without a dew claw up above.

Now compare the one thats standing upright to the one thats on all fours.

Look at the right hind leg thats on a rock. You can see the claw and 2 bones behind it. The one thats upright has the claw and one bone behind it.

Can someone explain if thats correct or not? Its kinda odd that a bone ends up missing when its standing upright compared to being on all fours.

Anook · Post by **Anook** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 4:06 pm

I think that was just accidental.

redwolfmoon · Post by **redwolfmoon** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 9:39 pm

Here, I'll help with that. I wanted the upright one to have the best examples of paw structure, so I anbled the hind foot so that you could see the number of toes (5) and a dew claw. This is because when you look at a human foot, there are the initial five toes and a bit of cartalige on the inside bridge that could form a dew claw or pad. On the quadrapedal skeleton, the hind paws are at an angle so that you cannot fully veiw all tendons, toes, or claws. The right hind paw is angled sideways and the left is angling away from the veiwer.

Hope that cleared that up.

Kirk Hammett · Post by **Kirk Hammett** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 10:18 pm

I think it's impressive! I haven't got a good knowledge, though, of skeletons, even though I collect skulls because I do a lot of it in Biology and Australia has a lot of skulls lying around. (Besides my grandparents give them to me...I must be an evil grand daughter or something).

I know more about skull structure and adaptations than any skeletal structure so to me that looks so cool!

And ooh a thylacine!!!

And another thing: Americans, and other countries, seem to believe Koalas are cute. Just looking at the koala picture there. They're cute, but trust me, they could really, really rip your face off. They are NOT gentle animals. Pick on them, and they could do some serious damage. Brown bears look cuddly too, don't they. But they're not!

redwolfmoon · Post by **redwolfmoon** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:00 pm

Thank you, I appreciate everyones input so far ^^

...um... Kirk Hammett If you have any skulls that you don't want anymore....COULD I HAVE THEM, PLEEEAAASSEEEE!? I hace a small collection right now, a few antlers and tiny bird skulls, but nothing really. I'm cute and cuddly and you know you want to.

(My friends all said that if I was a different animal, other then a wolf, I would be a Koala, cute and fuzzy on the outside and crazy mean if I'm pissed off and don't want messed with.)

Voidmaw · Post by **Voidmaw** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:13 pm

I've posted this to another thread where a dewclaw was shaped into a sculpted hind leg, but since the subject is present, and it was likely missed:

Wild wolves lack this toe.

According to this BBC article, a sure way to spot a wolf with dog in the mix, is to sight for a hind dewclaw. Not all of the hybrids will have this indication, but those who do are a certainty of domestication: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/3602741.stm

Figarou · Post by **Figarou** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:58 am

redwolfmoon wrote:Here, I'll help with that. I wanted the upright one to have the best examples of paw structure, so I anbled the hind foot so that you could see the number of toes (5) and a dew claw. This is because when you look at a human foot, there are the initial five toes and a bit of cartalige on the inside bridge that could form a dew claw or pad. On the quadrapedal skeleton, the hind paws are at an angle so that you cannot fully veiw all tendons, toes, or claws. The right hind paw is angled sideways and the left is angling away from the veiwer.

Hope that cleared that up.

Yup. Sure did.

*wiggles toes*

Morkulv · Post by **Morkulv** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 11:34 am

I like it, except for the head. The head looks like a normal wolf's head, and therefore its too different from a human skull (the brain would likely get crushed by the change). But the rest looks good. Still not my view of a werewolf though, but its not bad.

redwolfmoon · Post by **redwolfmoon** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 12:03 pm

I know about the lack of hind dew claw on wolves. If werewolves have existed for as long as they have, it is possible that there has been some domestication.

As for the skull, I know that it is still extremely wolf, but that's what I wanted. As for 'the brain would be crushed' technically any individual going through a shift that is not under a magical inchantmant would die. The body would change on such a molecular level, every cell changing, bones cracking, everything changing, a person would either frie form the inside out or die of pain.
I'm not being rude, just honest. Besides, just like there are different kinds of wolves and people, there would be different lycans, each different to another in a different country.

Ex: An African Werewolf would probably have short oily fur, apearing still pretty human, to protect itself from the heat, the majority of the creatures in Africa having oily fur. While a Canadan Werewolf would have long thick Fur, probably looking more wolf than human. Just like humans and wolves, the appearance would vary between countries and climates. My lycans look like Canadian Werewolves because that would be what it looked like.

Morkulv · Post by **Morkulv** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 12:31 pm

Fine, but my point was, that if a human transformed in your type of werewolf, and crushed his/her brains, he would be stupid and send to the funnyfarm for the rest of his/her life, because I doubt that brains will grow back when transforming back.

23Jarden · Post by **23Jarden** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:00 pm

redwolfmoon wrote:
Ex: An African Werewolf would probably have short oily fur, apearing still pretty human, to protect itself from the heat, the majority of the creatures in Africa having oily fur. While a Canadan Werewolf would have long thick Fur, probably looking more wolf than human. Just like humans and wolves, the appearance would vary between countries and climates. My lycans look like Canadian Werewolves because that would be what it looked like.

Does the African wolf have a different structure then the Canadian one? You said it would look more human. Did you mean it wouls be different in structure or fur? If it was in fur, would just look like a ditigrade Anubis? YES! I know he's a jakal!

redwolfmoon · Post by **redwolfmoon** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:18 pm

Morkulv, I can understand what you are saying, but in any werewolf transformation, save the old fashion werewolf with the gypsy and all, the skull shape changes. The size of the brain cavity on my werewolves does not change, it is mainly the rest of the skull that changes as the brain cavity is slightly adjusted into postition, when it shifts back the cavity is slowly repositioned as the rest of the body changes back as well. It is how the cavity does not change in size greatly and is rotated slowly that provents the brain fomr being crushed.

As to 23Jarden's question, yes. Just as the Timber or Gray wolf has a skeletal difference to an Etheopian wolf. The African werewolf would probably be a bit larger then its human counterpart, perhaps getting only 5" to a foot taller, as a Canadian werewolf would grow about 1'1/2 to 2'1/2 feet taller then its counterpart. I love these kind of questions.

Morkulv · Post by **Morkulv** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 7:51 am

redwolfmoon wrote:Morkulv, I can understand what you are saying, but in any werewolf transformation, save the old fashion werewolf with the gypsy and all, the skull shape changes. The size of the brain cavity on my werewolves does not change, it is mainly the rest of the skull that changes as the brain cavity is slightly adjusted into postition, when it shifts back the cavity is slowly repositioned as the rest of the body changes back as well. It is how the cavity does not change in size greatly and is rotated slowly that provents the brain fomr being crushed.

Thats were our visions vary. I don't see werewolves as another species, but more like a next evolution-step. And I think any rotating, and movement of the brain is very damaging and cannot be undone. But thats my opinion.

redwolfmoon · Post by **redwolfmoon** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 7:17 pm

yes, you are intitled to your opinion, yet so am I and would always appreciate it if, whenever anyone sees my work or reads things I have writted, when they ask something that they honestly want my feed back, rather then asking to not care. What you originally said was not constructive critism, nor anything else. Rather then asking you jumped to a conclusion of the brainy crushes. In my aspect Werewolves once existed, so any anatomy or view of what a werewolf would look like is completely hypothetical, so it really wouldn't matter too much! I myself am extremely sick and tired of Hairless Man-Rats taking the place of wereWOLVES, not a fuzzy man like Lon Chaney Jr., not a naked rat wolf like RJ Lupin!
Any records of Lycans say either 'He was a man one moment and a wolf the next' or 'the wolf walked as man', not 'the furry man' not 'rat man', the WOLFman, it would only be sensible for a werewolf to look like a wolf!

Vuldari · Post by **Vuldari** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 10:24 pm

redwolfmoon wrote:...Any records of Lycans say either 'He was a man one moment and a wolf the next' or 'the wolf walked as man', not 'the furry man' not 'rat man', the WOLFman, it would only be sensible for a werewolf to look like a wolf!

I've learned to open my mind to all posibilities (not without some difficulty) and have actually come to be rather fond of BOTH the fuzzy-face variety AND the HP3 werewolf for their own unique, albeit 'odd', charms.

...however, primarily, in my mind I feel the same way, most of the time.

It's called a "WereWOLF". If it has no wolf in it, but is something else entirely, shouldn't one call that creature something else then?

I hold a great preference for werewolves that ARE Wolves...but this topic has been beaten to death multiple times allready, so I think I should stop before I go any further.

*Duct Tapes own mouth and sit's quietly in corner*

23Jarden · Post by **23Jarden** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:59 am

How does this keep coming up?

Morkulv · Post by **Morkulv** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 1:49 pm

dnl · Post by **dnl** » Sat Jun 24, 2006 12:10 am

Morkulv I don't want to have a debt in this thread so I'll just say that there are millions of whys the body could change and not kill the person. With out any werewolf body's of evidence to there even existence all possibilities can be considered. Personily I like them. Nice pics

23Jarden · Post by **23Jarden** » Sat Jun 24, 2006 1:19 pm

I'm interested to see what your ideal werewolf is Morkulv.

Morkulv · Post by **Morkulv** » Sat Jun 24, 2006 1:33 pm

Yeah, I'm wondering about that myself as well. Somehow I can't get it on paper... The picture that Shadow_wulf posted comes close, though.

I am such a terrible perfectionist...

23Jarden · Post by **23Jarden** » Sat Jun 24, 2006 1:54 pm

lol Don't worry. Your not alone.

Vuldari · Post by **Vuldari** » Sat Jun 24, 2006 4:12 pm

Morkulv wrote:Yeah, I'm wondering about that myself as well. Somehow I can't get it on paper... The picture that Shadow_wulf posted comes close, though.

I am such a terrible perfectionist...

I must admit, that image did stand out a bit as a rare, more balanced blend of human and animal in the face.
Though I still think it looks more like a WereBear.

I was recently browsing through my 1,000+ archive of TF related images when I came across one that reminded me of this conversation. Here is a Crop and Zoom on the highlight of the image.
(Here is the full Original Image.)

This one allways stood out as one of my favorites because in the last part, the girls face was the best blend of human, with the canine muzzle that I had ever seen. Not only does it make for a great in-between shot, but it looks good and natural enough to stand well on it's own as a final product.

Not quite the "Perfect" example of what I think the best 50/50 blend Man/Wolf Werwolf would look like (not "Beastly" enough to be a Werewolf final form, IMHO), but it's another interesting example of how it could be done.

...and NO, I don't remember who drew this...

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Anatomy

Anatomy

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