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The reason I think super-muscley things look unnatural is because they ARE unnatural. Just because someone can look that way doesn't make it natural. Bodybuilders have to work for all that bulk. They eat special diets and do special exercises. A person isn't going to look that way from just being active and healthy. An animal isn't either. Just look at all the predators in the wild. They're lean and fit, but not bodybuilder-esque.

As for hunched vs. not hunched, I don't have a preference on that.

They definitely shouldn't be overly muscled. But they shouldn't be undermuscled either. The size of their muscles should match the amount of strength required to perform whatever physical activity that they directors want them to be able to perform.

Hunched vs. unhunched
I think it should be a combo of both. Not completely upright like a human's, but not completely like a wolf. Forward and up, or diagonal. This way they can still have a lot of mobility with their neck and yet they won't look extremely one way or the other.

Remember that with a flexible neck, hunching over whenever it would be most visually effective, remains an option.

I wouldn't mind a hunched look so long as there's a natural feel. I didn't like the Dog Soldiers werewolves...they looked like people with great big wolf-heads on their shoulders, and to me it didn't look real. It was like Halloween. Maybe JarJar Bink's neck with fur + a wolf head? But no, really, I LOVED how fluid JarJar's movements were, and he couldn't be confused for completely humanoid. Lose the ears and fur him up, give him a muzzle instead of the bill, and he'd be nicely put together. On the road to the right were head?

A werewolf simply looks better muscular, you can ask alot of people and 80% will say yes. But not ripped by pretty musclular like my werewolf drawing with the ripped pants in my drawing thread. And I agree with Excelsia they should have a combination.

same here i like to draw them all muscly. make them look cooler see for you self i finaly got my pics on the forum

If a werewolf doesnt gain any mass or just a half an inch in the arm then the werewolf simply looks like pathetic creature with a wolf heads I say They should be well musclular but not ripped like this http://www.blizzard-art.com/img/cai/Werewolf.jpg But a werewolf would still look good this ripped anyway wich no one has complained about except some I met here.

I don't like the whole muscley thing much, either...they're werewolves, not something like werebears or werelions, which are much larger animals. Not every werewolf should be all ubermuscley, anyway...to me it's the same logic as not all werewolves are 6'8" body builders and skinny slinky sex kittens. There's bound to be some variety..

yea, but whats the fun in that

NarnianWolfen wrote:I don't like the whole muscley thing much, either...they're werewolves, not something like werebears or werelions, which are much larger animals. Not every werewolf should be all ubermuscley, anyway...to me it's the same logic as not all werewolves are 6'8" body builders and skinny slinky sex kittens. There's bound to be some variety..

I know there should be some quality, but overall I think they should be very fit and muscular thanb an average human.

To be fair: What's the fun in being so ripped you can't even comfortabley cross your arms or hug your sweetheart? Werewolves are supposed to have supernatural strength...don't have to be rippling muscles on top of muscles to be strong.

I prefer necks that are slightly "hunched" and longer than a human's neck. I prefer heads that are at least 75% wolf (ideally, with lupine enough features that you immediately know you are looking at a wolf-based creature, not looking at a hairy demon, an ape, a dog, a bear or a rat). I can stand some under-surface shapes that aren't 100% lupine, especially a slightly shorter muzzle and a larger braincase. But I do not want the random-demon-dog-or-wolf look or something which looks more like a husky than a wolf (the husky mistake is easy to make when you try for something not 100% wolf).

Muscles: Wolves are muscular and ripped but not hulked out. They have big shoulders and a reasonably heavy, but long neck that connect all together; that's the biggest part of them. The rest is whipcord muscle with the quads being the next biggest thing. But the shoulders and neck are massive. They have to be if they're going to rip something as big as a moose apart.

The skinless wolf in "The Company of Wolves" showed wolf musculature beautifully. You remember the scene where Stephen Rea rips off his clothes, then his skin and transforms into a wolf in his former wife's cottage?

*hasn't seen that one yet*

Do see it. It's a real departure from the norm and they treat the whole werewolf legend well.

Personal plug: I went to school with Micha Bergese, who plays the Huntsman in the movie. He came back to school after being away a whole semester and told me what he'd been doing. He said that while they had him in the chair, doing the wolf-change scene, he thought about me and the lifesize werewolf puppet I terrorized the school with one Hallowe'en

We all know what the average human looks like. Not uber muscle-y. As for the animals, I've done a search for pics. You can clearly see even the bears are not bodybuilder-esque. (Should we start another topic or a poll about the muscles? 'Cuz I will argue until the cows come home.)

Wolf, front view: http://www.poster.net/cox-daniel-james/ ... 000304.jpg
Wolf, side view: http://www.mayura.freeserve.co.uk/newbremen/wolf.jpg
Lion, male, side view: http://www.mcadoophotography.com/africa ... ale610.jpg
Grizzly bear: http://www.travelwithachallenge.com/Ima ... y_fish.jpg

None of these animals look muscle-y. But they can easily knock you through the dry wall. The bulk of a male lion's head is all in the mane. Fur makes things look bigger than they are, just get a furry dog and give it a bath and you'll see what I mean. As for the bears, they're bulky but not in the way a bodybuilder is. You can see that clearly in the picture. So why the fondness for unnatural looking weres?

Reilune wrote:We all know what the average human looks like. Not uber muscle-y. As for the animals, I've done a search for pics. You can clearly see even the bears are not bodybuilder-esque.

No but you can tell that the bear and the lion are solid.

I'm not fond of weres with huge giant muscles either. I dont even care for the look of human bodybuilders, its just...ewww
Big thick muscles just make them a lot less flexiable, restricts movements more, and would make em slower I think. A human that shifs to gestalt will be a bit taller and have a bit more muscle, but I dont want to see it overdone.
I like the way Goldenwolf does her weres. With both muscle mass and head/neck placement. I prefer the longer necks with the slight hunched look. Just imho

Reilune wrote:We all know what the average human looks like. Not uber muscle-y. As for the animals, I've done a search for pics. You can clearly see even the bears are not bodybuilder-esque. (Should we start another topic or a poll about the muscles? 'Cuz I will argue until the cows come home.)

Wolf, front view: http://www.poster.net/cox-daniel-james/ ... 000304.jpg
Wolf, side view: http://www.mayura.freeserve.co.uk/newbremen/wolf.jpg
Lion, male, side view: http://www.mcadoophotography.com/africa ... ale610.jpg
Grizzly bear: http://www.travelwithachallenge.com/Ima ... y_fish.jpg

None of these animals look muscle-y. But they can easily knock you through the dry wall. The bulk of a male lion's head is all in the mane. Fur makes things look bigger than they are, just get a furry dog and give it a bath and you'll see what I mean. As for the bears, they're bulky but not in the way a bodybuilder is. You can see that clearly in the picture. So why the fondness for unnatural looking weres?

For carnivores, much of their body is muscle. Canines have one of the highest muscle-to-everything-else ratios in nature. They have big hearts and lungs, small stomach and guts, and lightweight bones for long-distance running. I think what you really mean is that these animals are not obviously muscular to the casual viewer, because they don't have muscles that bulge and "pop" from the surface like we are used to in bodybuilders. Solid, well-aligned muscles can more easily be designed by nature to be stronger than bulgy muscles anyway, because bulgy muscles don't pull at a straight-on angle. An 80-pound baboon can beat up any human bodybuilder any time it wants to.
In this I agree with you. I don't want to see werewolves that look like bodybuilders (unless that's what they were as humans) because it strikes me as unrealistic and not asthetically pleasing.

I'm the one guy who said that neck should be diaganol. I think there'd be alot more mobility, but I'm not a expert or anythingI leave that for the local biologists.

23Jarden wrote:I'm the one guy who said that neck should be diaganol. I think there'd be alot more mobility, but I'm not a expert or anythingI leave that for the local biologists.

I tend to agree with you on neck position.


I'd like to add some more thoughts that I have about the head. I think the muzzle should be slightly thicker than a wolf's muzzle. This is just a personal preference, I think it would make them look fiercer.

outwarddoodles wrote:


As seen a Wolf's skull has less space for the brain but alot of space on the sides for their jaw muscles. While a human's skull has a nice amount of space for their brains, and not much for jaw muscles. I think our 'uber wolf' is going to need the back of the head shaped differently for the brain to be held in there, which may effect the jaw strength but the brain is more importnat than the jaw.

So I'd image the back of the head gaining a more human shape, but with a nice canine muzzle, different features such as the fur, nose, and ears and other what not would make it much more wolf like. The neck may attach more human like, for the shoulders would be shaped much like ours, and the neck fur may cover up anything that looks weird.

Excactly. So the head of a werewolf can't be 100% wolf, because else the brain will have to shrink or something.

I'd like to see the jaw stretch out more, when in TF. But not make a wolf-snout, because that will look silly, believe me. So just a subtile snout. And I would like the werewolf to remain the human hair on his head. It can't just fall out or something, because then it looks fake, IMO.

eh...I think the head should just be a mainly lupine head that is larger than a wolf head, that way there would be enough room for the brain.

Excelsia wrote:eh...I think the head should just be a mainly lupine head that is larger than a wolf head, that way there would be enough room for the brain.

that is how I have always seen it as well

Morkulv wrote:I'd like to see the jaw stretch out more, when in TF. But not make a wolf-snout, because that will look silly, believe me. So just a subtile snout.

Pseronally I think that would make it look more like a bear than a wolf.