What kind of transformation scene do you like best?

Lasthowl · Post by **Lasthowl** » Thu Dec 02, 2004 8:56 pm

Think-Harder wrote:I have never seen a werewolf enjoy a full transformation, or a werewolf that was not vicious towards humans when fully transfomed if they were not being attacked by a human, and I have especially never seen a distinction made between the two genders. I would like to see something different. That doesn't rule out the possiblity that there would'nt be villian werewolves who enjoy killing humans for pleasure though.

Again, I never suggested that they'd be mindless vicious monsters. Just keep in mind those claws and fangs aren't for show and remember that this shouldn't just be Dawson's Creek with fur.

Apokryltaros · Post by **Apokryltaros** » Fri Dec 03, 2004 11:52 am

Lasthowl wrote:
Think-Harder wrote:I have never seen a werewolf enjoy a full transformation, or a werewolf that was not vicious towards humans when fully transfomed if they were not being attacked by a human, and I have especially never seen a distinction made between the two genders. I would like to see something different. That doesn't rule out the possiblity that there would'nt be villian werewolves who enjoy killing humans for pleasure though.
Again, I never suggested that they'd be mindless vicious monsters. Just keep in mind those claws and fangs aren't for show and remember that this shouldn't just be Dawson's Creek with fur.

On the one paw, I think it would be fun to watch a scene where the werewolf transforms in order to rescue someone else, pulling them out of a flaming carwreck, scaring off another monster of somesort, etc.
On the other paw, I think it would be better if they ate the teacher, rather than seduce the teacher.

Vuldari · Post by **Vuldari** » Fri Dec 03, 2004 12:16 pm

I believe that it has been,(almost), universally agreed upon that the Werewolves in this movie should be shown as not inherantly evil or bloodthirsty.
However, I feel it is very important that we also get a very clear example of what a person is capable of with the instincts and body of a full carnivore...with the right motivation. Do you really want a movie with Werewolves who are afraid to use their claws?
Show me the RAGE!

Apokryltaros · Post by **Apokryltaros** » Fri Dec 03, 2004 12:27 pm

Vuldari wrote:I believe that it has been,(almost), universally agreed upon that the Werewolves in this movie should be shown as not inherantly evil or bloodthirsty.
However, I feel it is very important that we also get a very clear example of what a person is capable of with the instincts and body of a full carnivore...with the right motivation. Do you really want a movie with Werewolves who are afraid to use their claws?
Show me the RAGE!

*gasp*
But we might hurt someone!
Or worse, we might chip a nail!

akujiwolf · Post by **akujiwolf** » Fri Dec 03, 2004 1:57 pm

Apokryltaros wrote:
Vuldari wrote:I believe that it has been,(almost), universally agreed upon that the Werewolves in this movie should be shown as not inherantly evil or bloodthirsty.
However, I feel it is very important that we also get a very clear example of what a person is capable of with the instincts and body of a full carnivore...with the right motivation. Do you really want a movie with Werewolves who are afraid to use their claws?
Show me the RAGE!
*gasp*
But we might hurt someone!
Or worse, we might chip a nail!

lol. Well the idea is that the werewolves are inherantly neutral, but the human's character's and desires influence whether they are bloodthirsy killing machines or heroes. But yes, there will be some "rage".

NightmareHero · Post by **NightmareHero** » Fri Dec 03, 2004 8:54 pm

CAlypso Blue wrote:What do you think about a 360 degree shot, the camera moving aroudn two individuals holding each other while they transform together? No cuts.. but moving camera.

On second though I've imagined this scene in my mind, it would work well if it were a fight scene, but if it is supposed to be a tender moment, then avoid the 360 movement. Love scenes, or those that are implied, to get the audience in the mood, should be slow and tender, not fast paced. Doing otherwise gives the wrong feeling to the audience, since such shots are associated with action sequences. and intimacy is slow paced next to action. Showing them transform slowly and then kiss with their muzzles or pet each other has more impact then spinning the camera and showing them transform from all sides.

If you want an implied love scene, then show both lovers caressing all their partner's body parts as they transform, maybe even helping them out of their cloths if they're not naked. And don't forget the advent of "dark outlines" lit by the moon, you could show them connecting or connected, without too color or texture.

Winter · Post by **Winter** » Sat Dec 04, 2004 10:17 am

I like Think harders idea...the couple, male and female slowly taking off each others clothing as they start to alter, i mean its a bit erotic in mind but its nothing like nashing and pain and groaning in pain, blood splattering changes..you see in werewolf movies.. I like the idea of the female pulling down her lovers pants, the member starting to visably grow a sheath and enlarging...the female having her top removed as her chest rises, sligh enlargment but nothing like watermellons... as fur starts to coat both bodies...the touch from formikng paw hands gentle as she strokes the altering member... her breath soft to his cheek fur as the muzzles push out like luquidized flesh...

Winter · Post by **Winter** » Sat Dec 04, 2004 10:20 am

Or it can appear like clay, or simple stretching...though the stretching sounds the least painful if not pleasurable...

NightmareHero · Post by **NightmareHero** » Sat Dec 04, 2004 2:07 pm

Winter wrote:I like Think harders idea...the couple, male and female slowly taking off each others clothing as they start to alter, i mean its a bit erotic in mind but its nothing like nashing and pain and groaning in pain, blood splattering changes..you see in werewolf movies.. I like the idea of the female pulling down her lovers pants, the member starting to visably grow a sheath and enlarging...the female having her top removed as her chest rises, sligh enlargment but nothing like watermellons... as fur starts to coat both bodies...the touch from formikng paw hands gentle as she strokes the altering member... her breath soft to his cheek fur as the muzzles push out like luquidized flesh...

I really like how you think...

NightmareHero · Post by **NightmareHero** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 10:48 am

Also I'm curious to know how they would implement a scene with an actor or actress using prostethics if the werewolve are supposed to be digigrade with their femur bones cracking and reforming. One way would be to make a full body porstetic maniquin with the actor/actress/face mold taken, but that may require A LOT of animatronics. If they are to move the digigrade legs substantially while semi transformed, for example, the woman could move hers up and down in place, while soothing her thighs to give her comfort, or the more difficult, haveing them walking in that state. The other solution I have mentioned is a full CG model. After some futher thought. I've figured out the only way that could be done without altering the bone structure of the model is to have the femur be composed of TWO bones in the model mesh in human form. their bones would simply lenghten and reposition themselves.

As to the face, well, I know that Poser 5 has a feature for using a real person's face on the model's mesh. I imagine that there might be something similar in Lightwave available, or a plugin could be created for this. But that is all up to them.

Ah well just something more to think about.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 1:10 pm

One of the most neglected aspects of a werewolf's transformation is the alteration of his/her mental state in the initial stages of the change. I think it would be more dramatic to see a persons animalistic tendencies gradually come to the surface in the days leading up to the full moon, foreshadowing what is to come by means of subtle alterations in behavior. A new werewolf might fight against it, or to deny what is happening.
Consider the trauma and confusion that would ensue if you suddenly found yourself afflicted with a barrage of primal impulses, driven to consume things that would otherwise be repulsive, unable to conduct higher level reasoning or to communicate...
This would open up the opportunity to dramatize the contrast between the werewolf's human and animal form, by highlighting the contrast between their respective impulses.
This sort of thing would undoubtably affect the werewolf's relationships, both private and professional. It might drive some Were's into a sense of displacement, concluding that they no longer belong in human society, or in the world of wolves....

Lasthowl · Post by **Lasthowl** » Mon Dec 06, 2004 2:20 pm

I don't know who this guest is, but I like the cut of his jib.

Starfury · Post by **Starfury** » Sun Dec 12, 2004 3:55 am

Anonymous wrote:Whatever you guys decide to do with this movie regarding TFs, I only have one request: please make a good, detailed, and long (preferably around two minutes at least) TF involving a girl changing. There has never been a decent female werewolf TF before on film.

So something that someone said totally made me think of the Incredible Hulk . . . but instead of a nice guy trying to help everyone and turning into a big green monster every time he gets hit, hurt, angry, upset, electrocuted, thrown over a car . . . you get the point, we now have a werewolf. Hehehe. Anyway.

Ok, yeah I have to say that a nice, long, detailed TF of a girl would be spectacular. I'm thinking more along the lines of AWIL with a girl would be cool though. I think that would please a lot of people either way. It has a girl, a long detailed TF, she can't control it, she doesn't know what's happening to her body, there's some decent nudity but not over the top, and the clothing could be optional depending on which way you want to go with that. Of course that's just an example of what kind of TF I think would be a nice compromise.

LoupGarou · Post by **LoupGarou** » Sun Dec 12, 2004 3:38 pm

I think a female transforming would be a sexy thing to see,wether it's disgusting or not doesn't matter,the female body is always a beautiful thing to see...if it's well built of course.
The camera could swoop up and down various sexy curves while shape shifting is being made.

Figarou · Post by **Figarou** » Sun Dec 12, 2004 3:45 pm

I know some people hate CG werewolves. But you need to remember that things can be easily done in CG compared to a mechanical costume. A human was not designed to run on all fours. Even with a costume with special extentions. With CG, a werewolf can "double shift" to fit its needs. When standing on 2 legs, it can look a certain way. But when it wants to run on all fours, it can change its body to accommodate it. CG can make it happen smooth and easy. With advancements in CGI, things are looking more realistic. Just look at Shrek 2. The trees look real, even though its CGI.

NightmareHero · Post by **NightmareHero** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 12:33 am

Figarou wrote:I know some people hate CG werewolves. But you need to remember that things can be easily done in CG compared to a mechanical costume. A human was not designed to run on all fours. Even with a costume with special extentions. With CG, a werewolf can "double shift" to fit its needs. When standing on 2 legs, it can look a certain way. But when it wants to run on all fours, it can change its body to accommodate it. CG can make it happen smooth and easy. With advancements in CGI, things are looking more realistic. Just look at Shrek 2. The trees look real, even though its CGI.

I agree completely with you on this... especially with making fluid lifelike movement, instead of being limited by animatronics or puppetry. Yes Yoda from ESB was good, but the character didn't jump walk great distance, or was showen fighting with a lightsaber untill AOTC...Hopefully one day it will get so easy and economical to do, that most Fan films will be CG, but I don't expect that happening until more than fifty years, FYI...

NightmareHero · Post by **NightmareHero** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 12:40 am

LoupGarou wrote:I think a female transforming would be a sexy thing to see,wether it's disgusting or not doesn't matter,the female body is always a beautiful thing to see...if it's well built of course.
The camera could swoop up and down various sexy curves while shape shifting is being made.

It DOES matter.....

If the filmmakers aim is to appeal to the female audience, to make the female audience RELATE to the female werewolf, assuming she is the heroine, then it be best that no aspect of her be disgusting, including her transformations, meaning that we shouldn't hear UNNATURAL sounds eminating from her body....Everything about her must appear as if it were natural for her...or if there is a male protagonist the same can be said for the male audience, and vice versa to make the males want to have the female and the females the male...However its all game if there is a villian werewolf....

This movie would have to do something that has never been attempted in a movie with werewolves and murder.....it WILL have to make the audience members who see this movie WISH that they could be werewolves...I'll leave you to think how that could ever be possible.....and maybe offer the answer sometime later....:-)

Figarou · Post by **Figarou** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 1:05 am

Think-Harder wrote:
Figarou wrote:I know some people hate CG werewolves. But you need to remember that things can be easily done in CG compared to a mechanical costume. A human was not designed to run on all fours. Even with a costume with special extentions. With CG, a werewolf can "double shift" to fit its needs. When standing on 2 legs, it can look a certain way. But when it wants to run on all fours, it can change its body to accommodate it. CG can make it happen smooth and easy. With advancements in CGI, things are looking more realistic. Just look at Shrek 2. The trees look real, even though its CGI.
I agree completely with you on this... especially with making fluid lifelike movement, instead of being limited by animatronics or puppetry. Yes Yoda from ESB was good, but the character didn't jump walk great distance, or was showen fighting with a lightsaber untill AOTC...Hopefully one day it will get so easy and economical to do, that most Fan films will be CG, but I don't expect that happening until more than fifty years, FYI...

fifty years? What? CG is everywhere now. It started out with Pixar when they was still with Lucasfilm. Dreamworks has "PDI" doing CG animation. Fox has "Blue sky" doing CG as well. Disney has their own CGI company now. Its not Pixar. They plan on leaving after they show "Cars."

There is small businesses that does commericals using CG http://www.rowsby.com/ is one. This guy likes werewolves so he may end up doing the CG for Re-Quest Entertainment.

There is more out there and its growing.

Vuldari · Post by **Vuldari** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 9:18 am

Think-Harder wrote:This movie would have to do something that has never been attempted in a movie with werewolves and murder.....it WILL have to make the audience members who see this movie WISH that they could be werewolves...I'll leave you to think how that could ever be possible.....and maybe offer the answer sometime later....:-)

I completely disagree with this comment. I do not think that the goal behind the way the Werewolves are presented should be to "make the audience wish they could be werewolves". I still stand by the idea that lycanthropy is a curse...something undesirable.
Since I really don't enjoy watching people suffer, I'm all for the werewolves learning that it is not ALL bad, and that it can even be enjoyable and advantagious at times. However, in the end, I feel that most werewolves would wish they could just be normal humans again.

...that is not to say that, if the werewolves look awesome in this movie, I won't find myself wishing that anyway.

NightmareHero · Post by **NightmareHero** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 9:29 am

Vuldari wrote:
Think-Harder wrote:This movie would have to do something that has never been attempted in a movie with werewolves and murder.....it WILL have to make the audience members who see this movie WISH that they could be werewolves...I'll leave you to think how that could ever be possible.....and maybe offer the answer sometime later....:-)
I completely disagree with this comment. I do not think that the goal behind the way the Werewolves are presented should be to "make the audience wish they could be werewolves". I still stand by the idea that lycanthropy is a curse...something undesirable.
Since I really don't enjoy watching people suffer, I'm all for the werewolves learning that it is not ALL bad, and that it can even be enjoyable and advantagious at times. However, in the end, I feel that most werewolves would wish they could just be normal humans again.

...that is not to say that, if the werewolves look awesome in this movie, I won't find myself wishing that anyway.

I meant in the same way that people after having watched Star Wars movies wish they were jedis or sith lords....How you identify with the heroes and villians of a story and would like to be them, though for this I meant on a different aspect....

And I think there could be certain aspects as someone mentioned earlier in another thread such as the hearing and smell, that would make it hard to work in a noisy environment or be in public, or do things that normal people would be able to do, so it wouldn't all be a blessing, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they would ALL have the urge for human flesh every full moon, so in that repect towards controling their animal urges and hurting people that doesn't necessarily have to be a curse, but should depend on the type of individual bitten.

Vuldari · Post by **Vuldari** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 11:25 am

Think-Harder wrote:I meant in the same way that people after having watched Star Wars movies wish they were jedis or sith lords....How you identify with the heroes and villians of a story and would like to be them, though for this I meant on a different aspect....

And I think there could be certain aspects as someone mentioned earlier in another thread such as the hearing and smell, that would make it hard to work in a noisy environment or be in public, or do things that normal people would be able to do, so it wouldn't all be a blessing, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they would ALL have the urge for human flesh every full moon, so in that repect towards controling their animal urges and hurting people that doesn't necessarily have to be a curse, but should depend on the type of individual bitten.

Some good...Some bad... but more bad than good. I just don't think it would feel right if the person who is/ or becomes a werewolf could say, "Alllright!!....I"m a Werewolf and I love it!"
However. As I commented at the end of my last post, and as you suggested about fans wanting to be sith lords, the fans will shrug off the bad points and wish for it anyway. True Werewolf fans need no further convincing. :mrgreen:

Figarou · Post by **Figarou** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 12:11 pm

Vuldari wrote:
Think-Harder wrote:I meant in the same way that people after having watched Star Wars movies wish they were jedis or sith lords....How you identify with the heroes and villians of a story and would like to be them, though for this I meant on a different aspect....

And I think there could be certain aspects as someone mentioned earlier in another thread such as the hearing and smell, that would make it hard to work in a noisy environment or be in public, or do things that normal people would be able to do, so it wouldn't all be a blessing, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they would ALL have the urge for human flesh every full moon, so in that repect towards controling their animal urges and hurting people that doesn't necessarily have to be a curse, but should depend on the type of individual bitten.
Some good...Some bad... but more bad than good. I just don't think it would feel right if the person who is/ or becomes a werewolf could say, "Alllright!!....I"m a Werewolf and I love it!"
However. As I commented at the end of my last post, and as you suggested about fans wanting to be sith lords, the fans will shrug off the bad points and wish for it anyway. True Werewolf fans need no further convincing. :mrgreen:

Wanting to be a character is not bad. But be carefull and not over do it. Look what happenend to the "Star Wars kid."

Winter · Post by **Winter** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 11:21 pm

Im not gonna shoot out too much, but be interesting if they took volunteers somehow to be transformed..for testing..

Vuldari · Post by **Vuldari** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 12:05 pm

Winter wrote:Im not gonna shoot out too much, but be interesting if they took volunteers somehow to be transformed..for testing..

Winter · Post by **Winter** » Fri Dec 17, 2004 2:41 am

Had strange idea. Was picturing something like this:

A person voluntarily records him or herself acting like he or she was changing...theln the cg people wold take that and use it for a test transformation...ect

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