THE PACK Message Boards

...And another thing. How do we know the wolf will go through a lot of pain during the shift? The wolf's body chemistry is different from ours. Maybe he can handle the pain. Or, maybe there is no pain at all to the wolf.

Answer me this. Why is it the female human have pain during child birth and the female animal doesn't? I seen animals giving birth on Animal Planet. I have yet to see one screaming in pain during the process...

.. that, figgie, is because huamn female skeeltons are adapted fro walking uprioght, so our pelvises are narropwer natrually. there is a trade ff between ease of birth and ability to walk upright. also we cannot twist and bend as much, and furthermore, a human child's head is fairly large.

Shadowblaze wrote:

...And another thing. How do we know the wolf will go through a lot of pain during the shift? The wolf's body chemistry is different from ours. Maybe he can handle the pain. Or, maybe there is no pain at all to the wolf.

Answer me this. Why is it the female human have pain during child birth and the female animal doesn't? I seen animals giving birth on Animal Planet. I have yet to see one screaming in pain during the process...

.. that, figgie, is because huamn female skeeltons are adapted fro walking uprioght, so our pelvises are narropwer natrually. there is a trade ff between ease of birth and ability to walk upright. also we cannot twist and bend as much, and furthermore, a human child's head is fairly large.

Or, to paraphrase one of my health teachers,
"It's akin to passing a gallstone the size of a melon."

The process of shapeshifting would entail the same physiologic strain to a wolf as it would to a human. Wolves physiologically are different in some ways, but the differences are not important where basic physiology is concerned, nor does it impact the transmission of pain signals. To have one species suffer and not the other would have to invoke some very arbitrary plot devices. If wolves don't have to suffer when shifting, then why not go a step further and make humans not hurt either?

Whoa whoa whoa - who said animals don't have pain during childbirth? Of course they do!! Ask anyone who's ever helped a dog or cat give birth. Ask champion horse or cow breeders or zoo keepers. They certainly do.

Animals don't talk, cry, or cuss out the baby's father, so we don't hear it the same way. But they do. All animals feel pain the way we do. They just don't react the way we do.

And my own experience at childbirth makes me think of it like this: I work out and do pretty strenuous activites. When I work out, I hurt - ache may be a better word, and sometimes the next day. It's not the same as how I hurt when I cut my finger or get injured. One is natural pain your body is built to deal with and the other isn't. Childbirth is like a really really really really really (you get the point) hard work out. It hurts a lot. A WHOLE lot. But it's a natural pain. The female body is built to do this so it's not like breaking a leg. It can involve some unnatural injury, but if it goes well, it's just doing what the body is designed to so. So, like working out, it's a pain that we understand and can deal with.


That's-I guess -why I think the TF would be painful at first, but that natural pain. Because NOW the body is designed to do it. It's NOT like cutting your finger or ripping a muscle. Your body would learn how to do it like it learns how to run longer distances, or handle heavier weights. It learns and therefore adapts to the situation.

Whew, I think I got off track here.


I still hold that if humans retain their intelligence and memories when they TF, so would a wolf. Why would it be different for one or the other? And no matter how severe the change, your body would adapt. See aboved

And I think a wolf's body would be contorting, even if it's not as much as ours.

I guess I should add that the canine WW would learn like a dog, think like a dog and react like a dog. The smartest dog ever known is still only capable of dog like abilities to learn.

Having dogs myself, I know they get frightened when strange things happen they don't understand, and especially if this involves them getting hurt. Even my big boy Doberman will get scared. How severe the change is, would only determine how frightened and confused they would become.

Well, I just learned something new.



Thanks.

Figarou wrote:Answer me this. Why is it the female human have pain during child birth and the female animal doesn't?

This may be a moot point now that we've decided animals do feel pain while giving birth, but:

Genesis 3:16

"Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children..."

For those that beleive in the bible anyway.

Silver wrote:I guess I should add that the canine WW would learn like a dog, think like a dog and react like a dog. The smartest dog ever known is still only capable of dog like abilities to learn.

Having dogs myself, I know they get frightened when strange things happen they don't understand, and especially if this involves them getting hurt. Even my big boy Doberman will get scared. How severe the change is, would only determine how frightened and confused they would become.

Just like inducting a new bitten member into the pack, a bitten canine would have to be watched and observed, placed in a safe secure space so that if it does get frightend/scared/confused it doesn't panic and hurt itself or others when changing. Biting pets or 'pet' wolves would probably be discouraged, but not strictly forbidden in a werewolf pack, and probably be a good thing to get permission to do so before bringing your pet dogwere to the next Pack meeting.

Horrible Idea: On the Full of the Moon, these Were-Humans turn from their natural Wolf form into Human insurance salesmen and Tax Accountants.....