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SabreWereWolfQueen_84 wrote:If real wolves do actually run just 45mph then a werewolf with the speed of the wolf and the human should easily outrun a regular wolf if you want to try to equally measure wolves speed, but hey again that's just me.....

You don't just add the two speed together. In full wolf well, you Got the wolf's speed, because in that form you're all wolf. Any human left in you is in such small amount it doesn't make a difference. Aside from your intelligence and conciousness. Thats the biggest remnant of humanity that'll be left.

In Human for its essentially the opposite. Its all Human, with slight trace amounts of wolf.

In Gestalt, its mixed. Meaning you'll run somewhere inbetween the speed of a Wolf or Human, not both combined however. Thats kinda...implausible.

Shadow Wulf wrote:plus sense the muscles are harden, it almost acts as armor when comes to absorbing punches, if your abs arent harden then if you get punched in the stomach youll lose more air and likely to be knocked out than a built person with muscles and built abs.

Actually no. Tense muscles sustain MORE damage than relaxed ones. That's why drunk people survive car accidents more often.

yeah but still, the muscles are harden so it wont get brused easily or the punches wont hurt as much. you try punching a guy in the stomach with really tough abs and then punch a guy who doesnt work out at all. who will sustain more damage, I go for the muscular guy.

Shadow Wulf wrote:yeah but still, the muscles are harden so it wont get brused easily or the punches wont hurt as much. you try punching a guy in the stomach with really tough abs and then punch a guy who doesnt work out at all. who will sustain more damage, I go for the muscular guy.

Hard things break easier, since they don't give as much. (The diamond is the hardest substance on earth, but I can break one with a hammer.) Go drop a ceramic teacup and plastic cup and tell me which breaks first. (Hint: It will be the harder one.)

this is different, the muscles work as an absorbant when comes to fist fighting if you dont harden your abs, then when you get punched there youll have the wind knocked out of you, lupin believe me I know what im talking about from experience, before when I got punch in the stomach I couldnt even breath, but after doing sit ups for a few weeks when ever I get punched in the stomach it doesnt hurt as much as it use to and I want even get the wind knocked out of me. cups works different from human muscles you know. thats a true 100% grade A fact right there.

Shadow Wulf wrote:this is different, the muscles work as an absorbant when comes to fist fighting if you dont harden your abs, then when you get punched there youll have the wind knocked out of you, lupin believe me I know what im talking about from experience, before when I got punch in the stomach I couldnt even breath, but after doing sit ups for a few weeks when ever I get punched in the stomach it doesnt hurt as much as it use to and I want even get the wind knocked out of me. cups works different from human muscles you know. thats a true 100% grade A fact right there.

Sorry but you're wrong. Tense muscles bruse and tear more easily than relaxed ones. I had this fact confirmed by several sites on the internet, and by my mother who is a nurse.

Edit: Think about it this way. A tense musle is already under stress. When you apply more force to it, it is going to be under even more stress, and so it will be that much more likely to break.

SabreWereWolfQueen_84 wrote:

Anubis wrote:this what I think what a werewolf can and can't do.

werewolves are strong enouf to rip car door off its hinges but not strong enouf to left the car its self over its head.

a werewolf's top speed is about 45 MPH when on all fours when on two legs top speed is 20 MPH.

werewolves are adgile enouf to make a cat jelous

extermly quick reaflexes

werewolves can't crawl wall like spiderman and the werewolf on van helsing. but they can climb walls by sticking thier claws into the brick and move up like on a latter.

they have super sonic hearing, acute sence of smell, see colors as well as a human has night vision.

I have to disagree with you on that speed thing and some other thing as well..let me explain....20mph on two feet is ridiculously slow and 45 mph on two feet is....well it's waty to slow, I mean look at a cheetah, it can reach speeds of 70mph and it's not a Were anything. Even a real wolf can run faster then that!! So I think the speed should pick up alot more than that personally. But everything else would fit pretty well

saber werewolves in gestalt are much slower because they weigh about 300 to 500 pounds (an estimation) so they would be pretty slow

Lupin wrote:

Shadow Wulf wrote:this is different, the muscles work as an absorbant when comes to fist fighting if you dont harden your abs, then when you get punched there youll have the wind knocked out of you, lupin believe me I know what im talking about from experience, before when I got punch in the stomach I couldnt even breath, but after doing sit ups for a few weeks when ever I get punched in the stomach it doesnt hurt as much as it use to and I want even get the wind knocked out of me. cups works different from human muscles you know. thats a true 100% grade A fact right there.

Sorry but you're wrong. Tense muscles bruse and tear more easily than relaxed ones. I had this fact confirmed by several sites on the internet, and by my mother who is a nurse.

Edit: Think about it this way. A tense musle is already under stress. When you apply more force to it, it is going to be under even more stress, and so it will be that much more likely to break.

I think what Shadow Wolf is saying that the guy with a gut like a neat stack of cinderblocks is not going to crumple to the ground in a whimpering heap if he's punched hard in the stomach, while his buddy with the squishy beer belly will crumple to the ground in a whimpering heap if he's punched hard in the stomach.
And what I think Lupin is trying to say is that if two persons of equal physiques are punched in the stomach, one having his abdominal muscles clenched so as to not present his beergut, and the other having his relaxed, the clenched abs guy will sustain more injury than the relaxed abs guy.
Oh, and as a rule, I've been told that most drunk drivers tend not to survive car crashes, in that, not only does drinking and driving don't mix, but, high blood alcohol levels and internal bleeding don't mix, either.

Aki wrote:

SabreWereWolfQueen_84 wrote:If real wolves do actually run just 45mph then a werewolf with the speed of the wolf and the human should easily outrun a regular wolf if you want to try to equally measure wolves speed, but hey again that's just me.....

You don't just add the two speed together. In full wolf well, you Got the wolf's speed, because in that form you're all wolf. Any human left in you is in such small amount it doesn't make a difference. Aside from your intelligence and conciousness. Thats the biggest remnant of humanity that'll be left.

In Human for its essentially the opposite. Its all Human, with slight trace amounts of wolf.

In Gestalt, its mixed. Meaning you'll run somewhere inbetween the speed of a Wolf or Human, not both combined however. Thats kinda...implausible.

I didn't say combine I said equally measure and in saying that I mean use a little of both kinda what your saying in your post, but still a werewolf should run faster than a human and faster than an wolf

Apokryltaros wrote:

Shadow Wulf wrote:so basicaly your saying the smaller you are the faster you are.

Who said that?
I didn't say that.
Ostriches are bigger than rheas, but they're still faster.p

I did, but I was talking canine form : ) A 150-200+ lb "wolf" is just not going to be fast.

Long legs does not mean speed. You see this often in racehorses. (My area of expertise is horses, while mielikkishunt's is dogs. You're not gonna win this debate.) Seabiscuit was a good example. "My horse is too small, the jockey's too big, the trainer's too old, and I'm too dumb to know the difference!"

Yep, I hadn't moved there, cuz most people don't know the difference between a Tbred and say a Belgian LOL

If real wolves do actually run just 45mph then a werewolf with the speed of the wolf and the human should easily outrun a regular wolf if you want to try to equally measure wolves speed, but hey again that's just me.....

Real wolves weigh

"Adult female gray wolves in northern Minnesota weigh between 50 and 85 pounds, and adult males between 70 and 110 pounds. Gray wolves are larger in the northwestern United States, Canada, and Alaska where adult males weigh 85 to 115 pounds and occasionally reach 130 pounds.

Adult female red wolves weigh 40 to 75 pounds, while males weigh from 50 to 85 pounds.
"
http://www.wolf.org/wolves/learn/basic/faq.asp#10

Were's at the least are going to double that mass, at the most, they're going to triple that mass. More mass means more energy to move it, more energy to get to any speed, more excelleration. Mass with the body build of an endurance animal equates to not as much speed as you want.

saber werewolves in gestalt are much slower because they weigh about 300 to 500 pounds (an estimation) so they would be pretty slow

Geez, those'd be some fat a** werewolves. . .so, only obese people are being bitten by weres? That being out of shape would slow them down even more, if they didn't drop dead of a heartattack.

If they are going to be stronger than humans by a good stretch (and it has been established that they will be)

Nope, it hasn't.

I agree about tense muscles taking more damage. In my karate classes, I hated it when we sparred. A tense muscle getting nailed hurts like the dickens. I'd much rather be relaxed and take the hit, so that I can roll with the force and thus decrease some of the damage done. You spread the force out, you don't anchor yourself down and take it.

Apokryltaros wrote: I think what Shadow Wolf is saying that the guy with a gut like a neat stack of cinderblocks is not going to crumple to the ground in a whimpering heap if he's punched hard in the stomach, while his buddy with the squishy beer belly will crumple to the ground in a whimpering heap if he's punched hard in the stomach.
And what I think Lupin is trying to say is that if two persons of equal physiques are punched in the stomach, one having his abdominal muscles clenched so as to not present his beergut, and the other having his relaxed, the clenched abs guy will sustain more injury than the relaxed abs guy.
Oh, and as a rule, I've been told that most drunk drivers tend not to survive car crashes, in that, not only does drinking and driving don't mix, but, high blood alcohol levels and internal bleeding don't mix, either.

thats what ive been trying to say but some people in this forum thinks to deep into things and dont use commonsense somethimes.

NarnianWolfen wrote:I agree about tense muscles taking more damage. In my karate classes, I hated it when we sparred. A tense muscle getting nailed hurts like the dickens. I'd much rather be relaxed and take the hit, so that I can roll with the force and thus decrease some of the damage done. You spread the force out, you don't anchor yourself down and take it.

you dont tense all your muscle, I was in tai kwan do, and what your suppose to do is keep some parts of the body a LITTLE tense, example your arm, you want it to be a little tense so you can block incoming hits better, if you dont have any tense in whats so ever then your arm is going to act as a noodle the punch would go right through, your legs are suppose to be relax somewhat in order to move swiftly around your opponent, but you want some tense in the leg thats behind the front one so when you get kicked in the front leg you wont go down so easily cause your back leg is holding you up. And believe me a tensed arm being punched hurts alot less than a relaxed arm being punched cause the muscles protects the bones from being hurt. Plus when being punched your suppose to move back your body or head so you can take less damage, I know your not suppose to keep everything so tense, you can get cramps that way too. One of the most important things you should never tense during a fight is the neck, when being punched in the head you want your head to go with the punch not agients it.
Thus quote the saying, "roll with the blows"

Quote:
saber werewolves in gestalt are much slower because they weigh about 300 to 500 pounds (an estimation) so they would be pretty slow


Geez, those'd be some fat a** werewolves. . .so, only obese people are being bitten by weres? That being out of shape would slow them down even more, if they didn't drop dead of a heartattack.

i was talking about muscle but after thinking about it i think the weight was a little exagerated but still they have a lot of muscle and muscle is denser than fat. which makes it weigh more. so about 250 to 350 pounds would be more like it. so with there hight and all that muscle they would weigh more than a average human wich slows them down when running.

If they are going to be stronger than humans by a good stretch (and it has been established that they will be)

Nope, it hasn't.

Actually, it has. Check out Silver's corner, and you will see it there.

edit: And I quote, "not as strong as Superman, but above the average human by a good stretch."

Well that's not saying much, as the average human would have a difficult time lifting even 50 pounds. (The weight of a bag of sweet feed.) Stronger than the average human does not mean stronger than a professional weight lifter. (Or even a farm girl like myself.)

Let me put it this way: you're saying you like weres who just fall short of uber wolf, I'm saying I like weres to be more realistic in their design and follow the laws of biology and physics. And those were my reasons why. If we were talking fantasy/magic werewolves I do have somewhat of a different preference in that matter. But we're not, so I stand by my statements.

Anubis wrote:

Quote:
which makes it weigh more. so about 250 to 350 pounds would be more like it. so with there hight and all that muscle they would weigh more than a average human wich slows them down when running.

Again, that's some fat a**, extremely obese Weres

Reilune wrote:Well that's not saying much, as the average human would have a difficult time lifting even 50 pounds. (The weight of a bag of sweet feed.) Stronger than the average human does not mean stronger than a professional weight lifter. (Or even a farm girl like myself.)

I buy 200+ lbs of dog feed at once, and there's never a guy around to help me out LOl. I'll have other customers offer to put it in my truck before I ever get one of the salesmen to do so

Let me put it this way: you're saying you like weres who just fall short of uber wolf, I'm saying I like weres to be more realistic in their design and follow the laws of biology and physics. And those were my reasons why. .

I agree. . .these are probably the same people who scream over the ceiling walking weres. . .but they want their weres to magically grow 100-200 lbs of muscles and 2 ft of height in a 5-10 min span.

mielikkishunt wrote:
which makes it weigh more. so about 250 to 350 pounds would be more like it. so with there hight and all that muscle they would weigh more than a average human wich slows them down when running.

Again, that's some fat a**, extremely obese Weres[/quote]your thinkig of humans!!! we're talkilg about a completely difernt creature! what could be fat for us could be heathly or under wieght for them

mielikkishunt wrote:

Let me put it this way: you're saying you like weres who just fall short of uber wolf, I'm saying I like weres to be more realistic in their design and follow the laws of biology and physics. And those were my reasons why. .

I agree. . .these are probably the same people who scream over the ceiling walking weres. . .but they want their weres to magically grow 100-200 lbs of muscles and 2 ft of height in a 5-10 min span.

Those are two completely different things though. You deal with walls and ceilings everyday. I personally have never seen a shapeshifter. If I punch a hole into the sheetrock next to me, and try to use it as a handhold, I'm going to end up flat on my butt. You can push the believeibility of fantastic things much more than you can mundane ones.

mielikkishunt wrote:

Let me put it this way: you're saying you like weres who just fall short of uber wolf, I'm saying I like weres to be more realistic in their design and follow the laws of biology and physics. And those were my reasons why. .

I agree. . .these are probably the same people who scream over the ceiling walking weres. . .but they want their weres to magically grow 100-200 lbs of muscles and 2 ft of height in a 5-10 min span.

Hey, I'm not the one who originally came up with the idea of them growing that much taller, that took place in a poll that was started before I even got here. I know this comment isn't directed only at me, but I wanted to say this anyway.

Also, I never suggested 100-200 lbs of muscle increase. But there should be at least some increase, if they are going to be a good deal stronger than they were before the shift.

Anyway, unless somebody posts something that I feel extremely compelled to respond to in this thread regarding muscles, strength, speed, etc., I'm not gonna post anything else in this thread about all that. I've made my thoughts about them clear, and I still think that my vision of the werewolf is at least possible, albeit very unlikely. I'm sure TA and AB will come up with something that will make everyone at least reasonably happy.

Reilune wrote: Let me put it this way: you're saying you like weres who just fall short of uber wolf, I'm saying I like weres to be more realistic in their design and follow the laws of biology and physics. And those were my reasons why. If we were talking fantasy/magic werewolves I do have somewhat of a different preference in that matter. But we're not, so I stand by my statements.

Acording to laws of biology and physics, there is no way a human can turn into a werewolf in under one generation, it would have to be as a evolution kind of thing, If you want things to be 100% realistc, then turning into a werewolf would imediately kill the victim right during the TF, there is no way for our bones to strecth out so fast and plus with all the extra bones it doesnt make any sense....a human doesnt store enough calcuim in the body. There is no way the heart and muscles can strecth out, if we dont gain muscle mass we would actually become weaker than our former humans self, you be able to break bones easier, your muscles will be so thin and youll get bruised easier. So yeah gaining muscle mass would be necesity.

Anubis wrote:

mielikkishunt wrote:
thinkig of humans!!! we're talkilg about a completely difernt creature! what could be fat for us could be heathly or under wieght for them

And where the heck is that extra muscle coming from?