THE PACK Message Boards

i think we haven't talked about this before if so shame on me.

well any way do werewolves have a true form?

i think they do (thier gestalt form.)

I would think that it would be the human form, since that the one they had "first" (before they got bitten.) Did we ever discuss whether it was easier to shift from human to wolf or vice versa? That would affect my answer.

Edit: Triple 8's, that's like my favorite number x3.

Lupin wrote:I would think that it would be the human form, since that the one they had "first" (before they got bitten.) Did we ever discuss whether it was easier to shift from human to wolf or vice versa?

yea, but what about the werewolves that are born werewolves.

Then it would be whatever form they were born in. I see true form as a first-come first-served sort of thing.

it really depends on how we see a werewolf, people like goldenwolf would think that the gustalt or full wolf would be the true form, while other like Scott have to have a very logical explanation would say the human would be thier true form. asking someones whats a werewolf true form is almost like asking someone what religion they believe, we're all gonna have different answer. but im gonna use the hollywood werewolf movie as an example. if a werewolf was originaly born as a werewolf, then the werewolf form is ther original form, but if someone were to just be bitten then its the human form thats true cause thats how they origanly were before.

Explain what you mean by 'true form.'

The way I see it, a werewolf is a werewolf is a werewolf. They can take on human form, or hybrid form, or wolf form. All of those forms should be natural to them (given time). I imagine their 'true form' would be that in which they are most comfortable, or the one in which they spend the most time. Or possibly the form that makes up the basis of their genetic structure (whatever existed before lycanthropy was contracted).

-- Vilkacis

Lupin wrote:I would think that it would be the human form, since that the one they had "first" (before they got bitten.) Did we ever discuss whether it was easier to shift from human to wolf or vice versa? That would affect my answer.

Edit: Triple 8's, that's like my favorite number x3.

Most likely the shift from human to wolf would be more difficult because that would be the first shift they undergo, which in turn would be the most painful. The shift back to human form would be just as painful, granted, but not nearly as shock-enducing as the original.

As for their natural form, well... It's debatable. On one hand, human was their original form, and on the other hand, gestalt is the most natural blend of human and wolf. What I would argue instead, however, is that it's ultimately up to the werewolf which is their true form, that being whatever form they spend the most time in. In most cases, that would be human, but as has been discussed in other threads, a werewolf might shy away from humanity and choose to live the remainder of his life as a full wolf, in which case that would become his true form. The only form that couldn't be their true form would be their natural form: the gestalt, because, in today's uber-paranoid society, a werewolf that chose gestalt as their true form wouldn't last very long.

It's ultimately all in how you look at it.

didnt I say youll get alot of different oppinnions, unless we have a werewolf come to this chat room right now and tell us whats thier true form, then thier is no right or wrong answer only beliefs...as if Lycanthropy was some kind of religion, the ones that think the gastalt is the true form would be on one side of the room while the ones that think the human form is the true one will be on ther other, and the one that think the full wolf is the most natural would be on another end..

If one's soul is wolf, i would call that thier true form.
But then anything else to me is just a worthless sack of meat and/or prey.

man i havent seen you in a while Vicous

same here, man

Terastas wrote: Most likely the shift from human to wolf would be more difficult because that would be the first shift they undergo, which in turn would be the most painful. The shift back to human form would be just as painful, granted, but not nearly as shock-enducing as the original.

If it's easier to go from human/gestalt to wolf (less painful, shift is faster, and whatnot), then I would think that the wolf form is their 'true form'. Same thing with the other two changes; whatever state is easiest to obtain is the 'true form'. Water seeks its own level.

If they were bitten as a human, then that would be their 'true' form. Or if a wolf was bitten than wolf would be their 'true' form.(if thats possable ) I guess I think more of it as what their original form was. What their true self really is depends on the individual. One may feel that the gestalt form feels the most natural'; while another feels best while as a pure wolf.

Lupin wrote:Water seeks its own level.

Now there is a good thought.

*ponders thoughtfully*

Now if teh werewolf were a speperate species, either the Gestalt or wolf form would liekly be considered their 'True form'. In the book I recently finished, the werewolves revert to their birth-form of wolves when in extreme pain, hurt, mortally wounded.

White Wolf has wolves also reverting to their 'true form' or birth forms when they are knocked unconcious or die.

Most movies forms show werewolves as becomeing human again. Some recent movies show ( like Gninger snaps ) that the 'true form' is the hybrid form.., but that the individual cannot change between the forms.

In Ginger snaps, along with the idea of a virus, the body is permentantly trnasfomred. There is no change between forms. Thus the 'true form' is that which they have become, and not what they were.

Old Mythos states that the 'human' losses their soul, and becomes as beast. Thus their 'true form' is a beastial human hybrid ( if you want to get a bit philoshophical about it ), though their physical form is or was first human.


~~~~~~~~~~

Now taking all this into consideration.., these is my thoughts on the matter.

~~

Since the going ideal is that the werewolims is passed on through a virual infection of sorts..,

Since the people infected are humans alone ( as far as I have read ) and not wolves..,

Since the born werewolves ( has this been disscussed? Thisis my take on it anyhow ) are born human form ( it is a human-attacking virus )..,

Since it effects the mind as well as the body..,

Sine it gets more difficult to shift between the forms as one ages..,

Since perhaps there are more and more outward signs of teh werewolfism as teh infection advances.., (? )


Then one would get the idea that once infected, be it born or no.., the werewolf is no longer human. Thus there is no "true form". They are what they are. From personal preference they may choose to stay on any of the three forms.., eventually that form becoming more and more natural to them.

The question is.., not sure where the thred might be.., but what happenes to th ebody when it dies? Does it just decompose quickly? revert to human? or stay in what ever form it died in ( which would seem more natural to me. )?

Silverclaw wrote:If they were bitten as a human, then that would be their 'true' form. Or if a wolf was bitten than wolf would be their 'true' form.(if thats possable ) I guess I think more of it as what their original form was. What their true self really is depends on the individual. One may feel that the gestalt form feels the most natural'; while another feels best while as a pure wolf.

The other thought is.., an dhas this also been disscussed?..., wether or not this is a "Tradtional" werewolf ( humans to beasts ) or a more modren version with Wolves being a part of this?

Could the "Infection" been passed on by a wolf at some point? o.O

Vilkacis wrote:Explain what you mean by 'true form.'

I like something Trinity said. I think their true form would be whatever the shifted back to when they're, hurt, in extremem pain, unconsious, whatever. Whenver they can't control the shift, they would probably go into whatever form they're most comfortable with, and that would really be their true form.

Lupin wrote:

Vilkacis wrote:Explain what you mean by 'true form.'

I like something Trinity said. I think their true form would be whatever the shifted back to when they're, hurt, in extremem pain, unconsious, whatever. Whenver they can't control the shift, they would probably go into whatever form they're most comfortable with, and that would really be their true form.

yeah but also I was thinking that what if they were origanly comfortable with human form but if they start to stay in thier Gastalt or wolf form the body will start to relax, adapting to the body as primary form. then later when thier serously wounded they woulkd probaly be so use to staying in Gastalt or wolf form that they wont Transformed back unless they want to or even if they die they might stay in that form or haf way to human form.

Shadow Wulf wrote:then later when thier serously wounded they woulkd probaly be so use to staying in Gastalt or wolf form that they wont Transformed back unless they want to or even if they die they might stay in that form or haf way to human form.

That's one of those situations where all bets are off.
On the other hand— er— paw, since shifting is stressful, going back to their 'true' from might kill them anyway.

In the new wold of Darkness that white wolf has produced, you still will revert to your birth form.., but when extremely hurt or in danger of dying, the instincts kick in and force you to your war-form because it is the more powerful and faster healing of the forms.

NOW. That is White Wolf's werewolf ( version 2 ). Not ours. ;)
But it is somethign to think about. What happens to a werewolf who is mortally wounded, will their instincts take over and force them to shift to somethign different ( either 'true form', breed form, or battle mode )? Or will they revert to a faster form and run away? ( Wolf )

So if we call the "Ture Form" : That which the werewolf reverts when mortally wounded, about to die, uncocnious -not of their free will ( being knocked out versus sleeping ), etc..,

I'm sure this will help clarify the debate. ;)

Lupin wrote:

Shadow Wulf wrote:then later when thier serously wounded they woulkd probaly be so use to staying in Gastalt or wolf form that they wont Transformed back unless they want to or even if they die they might stay in that form or haf way to human form.

That's one of those situations where all bets are off.
On the other hand— er— paw, since shifting is stressful, going back to their 'true' from might kill them anyway.

overtime shifting will become less stressfull as they keep doing it, now thats a bet

So perhaps the younger ones..,(bitten ) get 'stuck' in what ever form they die in.., while the older ones revert to.., something?

Trinity wrote:So perhaps the younger ones..,(bitten ) get 'stuck' in what ever form they die in.., while the older ones revert to.., something?

what do you mean

Shadow Wulf wrote:overtime shifting will become less stressfull as they keep doing it, now thats a bet

Well it might become less stressful, but it's still going to take time and energy, two things seriously wounded people tend not to have.

Trinity wrote:So perhaps the younger ones..,(bitten ) get 'stuck' in what ever form they die in.., while the older ones revert to.., something?

I'd say it depends on how quickly they die. If their head gets turned into a fine pink mist, I doubt they'd have the time to do any shifting.

Those werewolves who haven't -been- werewolves for long ( Younger but not by age ) don't have the contorl nor the abiality to deal with the stress of shifting. So when they die they die in what ever form they got killed in. Be it Gestalt, wolf, or human.

Their bodies can't handle the chnage between forms as well as older ( those who have been werewolves for longer ) werewolves can. So they "Get stuck" when they die ( or are mortally wounded, or unconcious, etc.., )

older werewolves, having been around for longer -as- a werewolf are also more used to the change. So they can either 'choose' what form they remian or revert to when they drop ( uncocnious death what ever ).

maybe even older werewolves, might have the same issues as younger ones, as their body ages - they loose some control?.

Lupin wrote:
I'd say it depends on how quickly they die. If their head gets turned into a fine pink mist, I doubt they'd have the time to do any shifting.

but that's just it. Its not what the werewolf -wants- or -choose- that is key. This is why the concept of "True Form" is such a powerful idea.

Its what happens to the body "naturally", wether its virus induced or not.

Trinity wrote:but that's just it. Its not what the werewolf -wants- or -choose- that is key. This is why the concept of "True Form" is such a powerful idea.

Its what happens to the body "naturally", wether its virus induced or not.

Well, I didn't mean anything about wanting or choosing, removing the head was just the fastest way I could think of to kill something. I just doubt that a werewolf could shift after they stop breathing and their heart stops beating.