overall werewolf abilities

[Vuldari]

I could do a point by point comparison of which opinions I agree and disagree with, but instead i think I will try to sum up my pesrpective as simply as possible.

Werewolves are impressively strong, fast and agile...

...their strength increases substatially when in Gestalt form...

...However...I think that a Werewolves strength would remain within normal human comprehension.

...meaning, a very strong, skilled and capable Human could win a hand to paw fight with an *average (*not the weakest or the stongest) werewolf.


(Ex: The greatest Human warrior would be a formidable, "worthy" opponent to the strongest werewolf, and the weakest werewolf in the world would be only about twice as dangerous as a stray Doberman... a BIG , pissed off Doberman. However, an average human would not stand a chance against an average werewolf.)
(...without artificial assistance, like a shotgun, a sledgehammer, or... say... an SUV travelling 50mph.)


All IMHO...naturally...

[Renorei]

...meaning, a very strong, skilled and capable Human could win a hand to paw fight with an *average (*not the weakest or the stongest) werewolf.

I am not in favor of this opinion, no offense. IMO, no human should ever be able to defeat a werewolf. To me, that almost defeats the purpose of being a werewolf. But of course, those are just my thoughts.

[Figarou]

...meaning, a very strong, skilled and capable Human could win a hand to paw fight with an *average (*not the weakest or the stongest) werewolf.

I am not in favor of this opinion, no offense. IMO, no human should ever be able to defeat a werewolf. To me, that almost defeats the purpose of being a werewolf. But of course, those are just my thoughts.

yup..I agree with Excelsia since the werewolf has fangs and claws that can tear into flesh.

[Renorei]

I'd like to mention (although I think I might have said it before ) that my opinions apply only to able-bodied werewolves and humans. Obviously a quadruple amputee werewolf in gestalt form wouldn't have much chance against anything. That would be slightly amusing, however. Although in a sad sort of way.

[Akela]

I could do a point by point comparison of which opinions I agree and disagree with, but instead i think I will try to sum up my pesrpective as simply as possible.

Werewolves are impressively strong, fast and agile...

...their strength increases substatially when in Gestalt form...

...However...I think that a Werewolves strength would remain within normal human comprehension.

...meaning, a very strong, skilled and capable Human could win a hand to paw fight with an *average (*not the weakest or the stongest) werewolf.


(Ex: The greatest Human warrior would be a formidable, "worthy" opponent to the strongest werewolf, and the weakest werewolf in the world would be only about twice as dangerous as a stray Doberman... a BIG , pissed off Doberman. However, an average human would not stand a chance against an average werewolf.)
(...without artificial assistance, like a shotgun, a sledgehammer, or... say... an SUV travelling 50mph.)


All IMHO...naturally...

I agree with everything but the hand to hand thing. So what if they're a werewolf, a shotgun blast to the head would kill them the same as any human. Being a werewolf doesn't make you unstoppable to normal people. You guys give way less credits to humans than they are due, don't get me wrong an average person couldn't kill one easily but Werewolf stregnth and Agility is no match for Skill, Experience...... and a big gun.

[Renorei]

I agree with everything but the hand to hand thing. So what if they're a werewolf, a shotgun blast to the head would kill them the same as any human. Being a werewolf doesn't make you unstoppable to normal people. You guys give way less credits to humans than they are due, don't get me wrong an average person couldn't kill one easily but Werewolf stregnth and Agility is no match for Skill, Experience...... and a big gun.

....Well, at the moment we don't actually know what werewolf strength is. There are a lot of differing opinions, and nobody knows what is correct, or rather what would be correct if they existed in the physical sense. Though I agree with you about the big gun thing, werewolf strength is still an unquantified factor.

[Figarou]

I could do a point by point comparison of which opinions I agree and disagree with, but instead i think I will try to sum up my pesrpective as simply as possible.

Werewolves are impressively strong, fast and agile...

...their strength increases substatially when in Gestalt form...

...However...I think that a Werewolves strength would remain within normal human comprehension.

...meaning, a very strong, skilled and capable Human could win a hand to paw fight with an *average (*not the weakest or the stongest) werewolf.


(Ex: The greatest Human warrior would be a formidable, "worthy" opponent to the strongest werewolf, and the weakest werewolf in the world would be only about twice as dangerous as a stray Doberman... a BIG , pissed off Doberman. However, an average human would not stand a chance against an average werewolf.)
(...without artificial assistance, like a shotgun, a sledgehammer, or... say... an SUV travelling 50mph.)


All IMHO...naturally...

I agree with everything but the hand to hand thing. So what if they're a werewolf, a shotgun blast to the head would kill them the same as any human. Being a werewolf doesn't make you unstoppable to normal people. You guys give way less credits to humans than they are due, don't get me wrong an average person couldn't kill one easily but Werewolf stregnth and Agility is no match for Skill, Experience...... and a big gun.

Big gun you say?

Who says a werewolf can't yield one of these puppies!!

[Vuldari]

I could do a point by point comparison of which opinions I agree and disagree with, but instead i think I will try to sum up my pesrpective as simply as possible.

Werewolves are impressively strong, fast and agile...

...their strength increases substatially when in Gestalt form...

...However...I think that a Werewolves strength would remain within normal human comprehension.

...meaning, a very strong, skilled and capable Human Could win a hand to paw fight with an *average (*not the weakest or the stongest) werewolf.


(Ex: The greatest Human warrior would be a formidable, "worthy" opponent to the strongest werewolf, and the weakest werewolf in the world would be only about twice as dangerous as a stray Doberman... a BIG , pissed off Doberman. However, an average* human would not stand a chance against an average werewolf.)

(*...without artificial assistance, like a shotgun, a sledgehammer, or... say... an SUV travelling 50mph.)


All IMHO...naturally...

I agree with everything but the hand to hand thing. So what if they're a werewolf, a shotgun blast to the head would kill them the same as any human. Being a werewolf doesn't make you unstoppable to normal people. You guys give way less credits to humans than they are due, don't get me wrong an average person couldn't kill one easily but Werewolf stregnth and Agility is no match for Skill, Experience...... and a big gun.

Hunh?...that is Exactly what I said. A werewolf is NOT invincible, and normal humans CAN be formidable, capable fighters.

(I've highlighted where I made those points in my message above.)

[Figarou]

Hunh?...that is Exactly what I said. A werewolf is NOT invincible, and normal humans CAN be formidable, capable fighters.

I could see a werewolf do a lot of damage to a human if it was hand to fang&claw combat. But give that human any type of weapon from a pocket knife to a rocket launcher, that werewolf will be in serious trouble.

[Vuldari]

Hunh?...that is Exactly what I said. A werewolf is NOT invincible, and normal humans CAN be formidable, capable fighters.

I could see a werewolf do a lot of damage to a human if it was hand to fang&claw combat. But give that human any type of weapon from a pocket knife to a rocket launcher, that werewolf will be in serious trouble.

Give a sword, a heavy club or even a rifle to someone, and their victory against an unarmed foe is still not guaranteed. An armed fighter can loose to an unarmed one in battle if the unarmed fighter is skilled enough.

...having claws and fangs does not guarantee that the werewolf will be able to use them against a skilled human opponent before that human warrior can strike a cripling blow first. ...when a werwolf slashes or snaps at you...it CAN Miss you know...

[Figarou]

Hunh?...that is Exactly what I said. A werewolf is NOT invincible, and normal humans CAN be formidable, capable fighters.

I could see a werewolf do a lot of damage to a human if it was hand to fang&claw combat. But give that human any type of weapon from a pocket knife to a rocket launcher, that werewolf will be in serious trouble.

Give a sword, a heavy club or even a rifle to someone, and their victory against an unarmed foe is still not guaranteed. An armed fighter can loose to an unarmed one in battle if the unarmed fighter is skilled enough.

...having claws and fangs does not guarantee that the werewolf will be able to use them against a skilled human opponent before that human warrior can strike a cripling blow first. ...when a werwolf slashes or snaps at you...it CAN Miss you know...

In order to bite or slash at the human, the werewolf has to be right up on him. So timing is the key. Its not like the werewolf is going to take off its paw and throw it at the human.

As for a skilled human opponent, a black belt karate expert or a heavy/medium weight wrestler should have no problem bring down an unskilled werewolf.

[Akela]

I could do a point by point comparison of which opinions I agree and disagree with, but instead i think I will try to sum up my pesrpective as simply as possible.

Werewolves are impressively strong, fast and agile...

...their strength increases substatially when in Gestalt form...

...However...I think that a Werewolves strength would remain within normal human comprehension.

...meaning, a very strong, skilled and capable Human Could win a hand to paw fight with an *average (*not the weakest or the stongest) werewolf.


(Ex: The greatest Human warrior would be a formidable, "worthy" opponent to the strongest werewolf, and the weakest werewolf in the world would be only about twice as dangerous as a stray Doberman... a BIG , pissed off Doberman. However, an average* human would not stand a chance against an average werewolf.)

(*...without artificial assistance, like a shotgun, a sledgehammer, or... say... an SUV travelling 50mph.)


All IMHO...naturally...

I agree with everything but the hand to hand thing. So what if they're a werewolf, a shotgun blast to the head would kill them the same as any human. Being a werewolf doesn't make you unstoppable to normal people. You guys give way less credits to humans than they are due, don't get me wrong an average person couldn't kill one easily but Werewolf stregnth and Agility is no match for Skill, Experience...... and a big gun.

Hunh?...that is Exactly what I said. A werewolf is NOT invincible, and normal humans CAN be formidable, capable fighters.

(I've highlighted where I made those points in my message above.)

No no, I said I agreed with everything except that a skilled human could kill a werewolf in a fair fight with his bare hands and I was disagreeing with Fig and Excelsia that humans are nearly powerless to stop a WW.

[outwarddoodles]

I agree with everything but the hand to hand thing. So what if they're a werewolf, a shotgun blast to the head would kill them the same as any human. Being a werewolf doesn't make you unstoppable to normal people. You guys give way less credits to humans than they are due, don't get me wrong an average person couldn't kill one easily but Werewolf stregnth and Agility is no match for Skill, Experience...... and a big gun.

....Well, at the moment we don't actually know what werewolf strength is. There are a lot of differing opinions, and nobody knows what is correct, or rather what would be correct if they existed in the physical sense. Though I agree with you about the big gun thing, werewolf strength is still an unquantified factor.

All and All, shapeshifting IS posible, all of us do it, our bodies have very well changed throughout our lives since our birth, obviously. So apparently thorugh genetic engirneering it is posible to slooooowly change over years into a wolf, don't know how, but maybe thas posible. I see no reason why a person would gain muscle mass at all during that time peroid unless they exercise. I just think of the shift as a REALLY sped up version of that. No reason they should gain muscle. Infact, as the body has changed so, our mescles are strong and fit to work our body, they are not used to controlling a wolf body, so some points that are unused in the human body may be very weak if they are used in their new forms. Though as said if torso is more human like then they should keep their upper arm strength, while the legs are in a much different position and would be another story.

I'd have to say the only thing making them more dangerous is their new speed, from greater stride length, and their new jaw full of pearly whites. I'd agree with Vuldari, it would be like a REALLY dangerous dog. Humans are in the first place bigger, and this is a werewolf, they would have a human mindset thus know exactly where to attack...that is if the apponets a man...

[Figarou]

No no, I said I agreed with everything except that a skilled human could kill a werewolf in a fair fight with his bare hands and I was disagreeing with Fig and Excelsia that humans are nearly powerless to stop a WW.

You know...there are some key factors missing here.

Take this for example.

You have a skilled human with a knife and a shotgun against a werewolf. The werewolf has no weapons of any kind. Just its fang&claws.

Now, put them in an arena and turn off all the lights. Who will win?


The surrounding plays a key part to who will win a fight. Remember that when you yield that rocket launcher in a wooded area.

[Vuldari]

No no, I said I agreed with everything except that a skilled human could kill a werewolf in a fair fight with his bare hands and I was disagreeing with Fig and Excelsia that humans are nearly powerless to stop a WW.

oh...wait...so you disagree with everyone then?

I understand what you mean, but I still think that a pro-Boxer or a Martial artist could be able to KO a Werewolf with a well placed blow (or three).

A werwolves bones can still break...they are still flesh and blood, and so would still be susceptible to "Blunt Force Trauma". ...such as a blow to the back of the head, or "knocking the wind out of it" with a swift, hard Knee to the gut...also, attacking the joints (knees, shoulders, ankles, wrists, etc.) is very effective against any living creature...even really strong ones.


I am not saying that it is LIKELY that a human would win in a fair fight. I'm just saying that if the human was skilled (or lucky) enough, and the Werewolf didn't have a perfect defense (which no creature, human or beast, does as far as I know) then it would be POSSIBLE for a human to win. If a human is strong enough to do physical harm to a werewolf, then it IS possible...however unlikely.

[mielikkishunt]

wouldn't be opposed, however, to cancelling out some diseases. For example, there are some diseases that humans get but wolves don't get.

And vice versa. Wolves get Parvo & Distemper, humans do not

Muscles and speed.

Arnold Schwarzennegger muscles will cancel out speed.

Basically, if I remember my biology right, that's the wrong type of muscles.

Want a Comparison?


Jezebel is a Greyhound, the fastest canine on earth if I remember right, with up to 45 mph speeds attained. You can see her muscles somewhat in this photo. They are very svelte, big a** butt muscles, wide loin, but that's it. The rest of a greyhound is very aerodynamic, from head to tail.


The next fastest dog if I remember my facts right, is a Saluki or a Borzoi at 35-40, and then the Whippet, and that's at 35 miles an hour a big jump, to the speed of a Greyhound, and none of these are bulky dogs

Your more common breeds can

Most domestic dogs are capable of reaching speeds of 32 kms per hour when running flat out but the members of the greyhound family may reach speeds up to 70 kms per hour.

Which averages out to about 20 mph

And when you add BIG DAMN muscles. .well, put it this way, I'd wager money my greyhound can outrun any Mastiff, Pitt bull, Bulldog, etc. . .lb for lb, she's faster.

[Figarou]

Oh...one more thing....when is there a time as a "fair fight?"

Is that werewolf going to ask the human not to use any weapons? Will that human ask the werewolf not to bite him? If the fight is to the death, both sides will do whatever it takes to win.

[Vuldari]

Oh...one more thing....when is there a time as a "fair fight?"

Is that werewolf going to ask the human not to use any weapons? Will that human ask the werewolf not to bite him? If the fight is to the death, both sides will do whatever it takes to win.

I would assume that the scenario of "a fair fight" would involve both parties entering an aria without any external weapons in their posession, or readily available, leaving each only with their physical bodies to use as weapons.
...thus...a werewolf would be able to use it's teeth and claws as a human could use thier teeth and fingernails as well. (Though the Werewolves claws would obviously be of far more use and advantage than fingernails.)

So the werewolf would have an obvious advantage over the human, but neither would have any "assistance", so it would be as fair as the scenario could be.

[outwarddoodles]

mielikkishunt; Thanks for pointing that out.

Theres also, as I've been pointing out and picking up several times; the torso.
Human Like Torso- I'd imagine the werewolf would retain around the same amount of upper arm strength in this form, but be slower, depite their new stride length they won't be that much faster, still faster though.
Barrel Chested - The werewolf would be weaker in upperarm strength but much more faster and speedy with the new body made for running, by the way the legs are positioned and the sleek airodynamic style.

Otherwise, as said, I don't know why the werewolf is going to gain muscle mass.

[Akela]

No no, I said I agreed with everything except that a skilled human could kill a werewolf in a fair fight with his bare hands and I was disagreeing with Fig and Excelsia that humans are nearly powerless to stop a WW.

You know...there are some key factors missing here.

Take this for example.

You have a skilled human with a knife and a shotgun against a werewolf. The werewolf has no weapons of any kind. Just its fang&claws.

Now, put them in an arena and turn off all the lights. Who will win?


The surrounding plays a key part to who will win a fight. Remember that when you yield that rocket launcher in a wooded area.

I begin to understand what you are saying, it largely depends on the situation.

But if we want to get into hypothetical situations;
Give a skilled human a visor equipped with Infra-red, Night Vision, and a motion detector in addition to a gun with ammunition that fragments upon impact then the winner would be obious.

[Renorei]

Why would werewolves gain muscle mass?


I've always thought of werewolves as being big, testoserone filled creatures, when in non-human forms. I've always sorta believed that the transformation would unleash the testosterone hormones in their brain, raising their muslce mass, and making them faster (by lengthening their legs). After all, men have more testosterone than women, and men are stronger and faster. Because the presence of testosterone makes muscle growth faster and easier, and also causes the individual to grow larger, giving men longer legs and making them faster, etc.

Speed (for bipedal creatures) is almost all in the legs. Give a werewolf long legs during the TF, and he'll be really fast. The excess muscle wouldn't affect them all that much, in terms of aerodynamics, though I concede it would have a slight effect.

And just to clarify, yes I know that the shapes of all our bodies are changing. But we sure as hell aren't growing fur and tails and digitigrade legs. We aren't shifting into an entirely different being, just larger and older versions of ourselves. So, we aren't really shapeshifters, IMO, at least not in the mythological sense. It is not possible (at this particular time) for any sort of human to transform into any sort of wolf. So, therefore, werewolf strength levels are completely unknown, that is until some scientist succeeds in making one or we happen to discover they've been around all along (highly unlikely). Transforming from human to a wolf-like creature is impossible at this time, although it is possible to make ourselves look like animals with tattoos, surgery, and implants.

Nobody really knows what a werewolf would look like, or how strong they'd be, or how big their muscles are, or how fast they are, or how formidable they are, etc. So basically, we're all just sharing our preferences. There are somewhat scientific reasons to back up almost any theory that any of us could come up with about what werewolves would be like, so I think we should focus more on what is visually appealing, and, in short, on what we like. I like muscly werewolves that are really fast, really tall, heal rapidly from wounds, are completely covered in fur, have predominantly wolven heads, and can't be beaten by any human in hand-to-hand combat. That is what I like, and I could spout off any number of reasons why that could potentially be scientifically accurate, but I don't really want to. I want to think about what I think looks good, and about what I think movie audiences will enjoy. The average moviegoer would lean more towards a very large, very fast, (to a certain extent)muscly, intimidating creature than one that wasn't. I could be wrong, but those are just my thoughts.

Anyway, let's worry a bit more about what looks good than about what would be accurate, shall we?

[mielikkishunt]

Speed (for bipedal creatures) is almost all in the legs. Give a werewolf long legs during the TF, and he'll be really fast. The excess muscle wouldn't affect them all that much, in terms of aerodynamics, though I concede it would have a slight effect.

Anyway, let's worry a bit more about what looks good than about what would be accurate, shall we?

Nope, because I create weres that are believable, and superwere's get on my nerves. And I know it gets on a lot of people here's nerves

Anyway, you're wrong about muscles not affecting aeroydynamis(and thus speed) take a look at the 'fastest' atheletes alive. . look at the fast track stars. .they are not ripped like body builders. That much bulk is going to be too dang heavy to move around, that's why even for their size, the Borzoi is very light weight. My 100lb male can not keep up with his 70-80 lb uncles, and they definitely can't keep up with the bitches.
excelerate faster, turn easier, and decelerate faster. . You go more bulk(Irish Wolfhound), and they are SLOW. It's just like comparing a HumV(Your version) to a sportscar(My version)


My were's are no more muscular than their humanoid form, but since their humanoid form is stronger than humans(they're not human!) that accounts for it. They're not faster in that form, but they sure are more dangerous with the teeth and fangs!

[NarnianWolfen]

I've always thought of werewolves as being big, testoserone filled creatures, when in non-human forms. I've always sorta believed that the transformation would unleash the testosterone hormones in their brain, raising their muslce mass, and making them faster (by lengthening their legs).

Except that as a general rule (as I understand anatomy) it's the woman's legs that are stronger in proportion to the rest of their body. Men got the powerful upper body, the arms. Get a woman and a man in great condition and it's the woman that's usually swifter on their feet, unless the man's some lightning-reflex martial artist. But that's what we have these awesome thighs and mile-long legs for. Woman are the leggy gender.

[outwarddoodles]

Excelsia;
No, so far we've have had no humans change into wolves, but shape shifting is true, we're all doing it. As I said, if a person were to change into a wolf, it would take a VERY LOOOOOOONG time, the only reason they would gain muscles is if they exercised around that time. Our mythical werewolf shouldn't etheir. I think a true werewolf, would take years to shift, and would have no gestalt, so in wolf form they would be a wolf, just a wolf, no 'uber wolf', exactly just a wolf. Infact, we're already pushing it by adding the gestalt form to a 'realistic werewolf'. I still don't see why the werewolf gains muscle mass, I'm just clueless there.

Yet imagine, everytime they'd keep getting bigger and bigger everyshift, the growing will never stop! That, or they'll keep getting fatter and fatter in human form if the muscle was turned into fat, which would then be turned into energy, usefull for the shifting process.

[Shadow Wulf]

true werewolf? outwarddoodles what the hell is this!?! No offence but your parents must of have you reading textbooks and grammer language when you were a little kid while the rest of the world was reading little red riding hood and George cause I dont see why is there a true werewolf in the first place, We do not shift, where do you get this idea we just grow taller from a former child self. If a tf were to happen in a looooooong period of time then I say a werewolf would have to wait untill his mid 40s or 50s. weather you believe me or not but growing extra muscle mass or having an outstanding immune system is far more realistic than TF into a werewolf. Why does this particurly thing HAVE to be explain in scientific theory when you can even explain eny other stuff about the werewolfs in a scientific way. Now dont take this the wrong way but Everytime theres something thats beyond your belief like muscle it seems like you imediatly attack it, you have to be more open minded, like am about things, I am open to all sorts of crazy unexplained things. Can you really explain why is there ghost in the world, they have theories but are not considered as hard facts. A werewolf is even harder to explain sense the sightings are so rare if there even is a werewolf cause it could be someone in a really good suite playing a practicle joke or it could be another animal. Until they officialy catch one, then a werewolf is considerd a fantasy creature and there shouldnt be something such as muscle mass stop anything. Just be open to possiblilities, you cant even explain anything about the werewolf shifting power in the first place. Plus a gastalt form is actualy more realistic than a full wolf by the way.