overall werewolf abilities

This is the place for discussion and voting on various aspects of werewolf life, social ideas, physical appearance, etc. Also a place to vote on how a werewolf should look.
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Post by Vuldari »

I suspect that the existance of a humans dexterous hands inspired the invention of tools. Quadrapalegic humans do quite well because they are able to use tools made by people who DO have hands to allow them to put their intelligence to use.

I think Dolphins only haven't "created" things because they lack the physical capacity to do so with any amount of practical efficiency. When exposed to the tools and concepts created by humans after generations of creative effort, Dolphins show an extrordinary capacity to comprehend what they are, how they work, and how to use them. Dolphins can learn advanced mathmatics and can be taught to construct complex objects. ...the trick is finding one who is interested enough in these things to bother trying.


...I guess there IS another factor to the uniqueness of Humanity. Our unquenchable curiosity. Put two square blocks in front of a baby dolphin and a baby human. Though both may comprehend that it would be possible to stack one on top of the other and create a tower, the human is far more likely to feel compelled to try it than the dolphin. ...or if they both tried it, the dolphin would be most likely to be satisfied with prooving its theory (thinking to itself "yup...I was right...it DID stay on top") and swim away, where as the human would naturally think. "woah...cool...I wonder if I can stack them even Higher...are there any more of these things?"
Excelsia wrote:*sigh* As much as I have enjoyed debating with you, Vuldari, I'd like to give it a rest. We have differing opinions, to which each of us are entitled, and there's nothing wrong with that. Truce?
NEVER Image

...just kidding...Image

You like Werewolves that are like "Living Legends", no matter what.

I Like Werewolves that are as "Mortal" and "Fragile" (physically and emotionally) as any other creature on this earth.

We will agree to disagree.

TRUCE accepted. *Shakes Excelsias hand...er...paw...eh...whatever*


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Post by Vilkacis »

Vuldari wrote:Quadrapalegic humans do quite well because they are able to use tools made by people who DO have hands to allow them to put their intelligence to use.
Tools... and smart little monkeys.

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Post by Figarou »

Vilkacis wrote:
Vuldari wrote:Quadrapalegic humans do quite well because they are able to use tools made by people who DO have hands to allow them to put their intelligence to use.
Tools... and smart little monkeys.

-- Vilkacis

Tools and trained little monkeys. Who trained them? Humans did. :D
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Post by Renorei »

Apokryltaros wrote:
Excelsia wrote:I still don't think hands are necessary for world domination, though they are helpful. Besides, my original point was that we don't rule with our hands, but rather with our minds. The hand is merely a tool of the mind. The mind is not a tool of the hand.
Without hands, we would have been unable to do things like utilize, or even make tools.
Our hands allowed us to manipulate our environment, and I assure you, we wouldn't be where we are today if we couldn't do things like pick rocks and throw them at wild animals.
I mean, let's see you practice horticulture or hunt wild elk without fingers.
I don't mean you as a werewolf, I mean, person-you.

I'm not arguing that our hands certainly helped us along to where we are now. I know that. But without our minds, we would be nothing. Just idiotic animals with hands. I'm referring to the current time, not the past. At this particular point in time, the mind is far more important than the hand. Thus, we rule with our minds and not with our hands.
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Post by Vuldari »

Excelsia wrote:I'm not arguing that our hands certainly helped us along to where we are now. I know that. But without our minds, we would be nothing. Just idiotic animals with hands. I'm referring to the current time, not the past. At this particular point in time, the mind is far more important than the hand. Thus, we rule with our minds and not with our hands.
I wrote:...*...Oh...and I beleive that it is the dexterity of the Human hand, Combined with our intelligence that makes us so unique. Raccoons and Baboons have the hands...and Dolphins have the smarts...but only WE have Both.
I never said hands were more important than inteligence. What I was saying is...Our inherant creative talent would never have developed as far as it has, had we not been born with such precise natural tools as our fragile little hands (with opposable thumbs). Our smarts would be restrained mostly to internal reflection without some way to apply it outside of our bodies. ...our hands are that outlet.

One is of limited use without the other.
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Post by Set »

Apokryltaros wrote:Without hands, we would have been unable to do things like utilize, or even make tools.
Tell that to the ravens. I've seen them make things with their beaks.
Our hands allowed us to manipulate our environment, and I assure you, we wouldn't be where we are today if we couldn't do things like pick rocks and throw them at wild animals.
Almost any creature with a mouth can pick up a rock and chuck it at something. It's just doing it with accuracy that's difficult.
I mean, let's see you practice horticulture or hunt wild elk without fingers.
I don't mean you as a werewolf, I mean, person-you.
That reminds me of when I was young and the teacher asked the class to try and tie their shoes without thumbs. It's possible, just very difficult. Even if you lost both arms right now you could still kill that elk by finding high ground and kicking a large rock onto its head when it walks by. I assume you're not one of those people with "monkey feet" or "bird toes" that can do quite a bit with their paws. Your attitude clearly says you're not.
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Post by Renorei »

Grr...I never thought I would get into an argument about hands.

The hand is a tool of the mind. A very, very, important tool, but a tool nontheless. The mind is the dictator of the actions of the hand. Perhaps it is our hands that initially led to the development of intelligence, but IMO it is the intelligence which now supercedes the hands in importance. If, all of a sudden, every single human being's hands and feet disappeared, the world would fall into chaos. But eventually we would work around it. We would find new ways to manipulate things. If, however, everyone on earth suddenly lost their human intelligence, that would be another matter entirely. Humanity would fall from greatness.

The mind is what fuels the hand's ability to manipulate things. Humans can manipulate things without their hands, but without their minds, they would not know how.
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Post by Apokryltaros »

Excelsia wrote:Grr...I never thought I would get into an argument about hands.

The hand is a tool of the mind. A very, very, important tool, but a tool nontheless. The mind is the dictator of the actions of the hand. Perhaps it is our hands that initially led to the development of intelligence, but IMO it is the intelligence which now supercedes the hands in importance. If, all of a sudden, every single human being's hands and feet disappeared, the world would fall into chaos. But eventually we would work around it. We would find new ways to manipulate things. If, however, everyone on earth suddenly lost their human intelligence, that would be another matter entirely. Humanity would fall from greatness.

The mind is what fuels the hand's ability to manipulate things. Humans can manipulate things without their hands, but without their minds, they would not know how.
To put it in another perspective.
What could a carpenter do if he needed to pound some nails, or unscrew some bolts and he doesn't happen to have either a hammer or a wrench?
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Post by Renorei »

Apokryltaros wrote: What could a carpenter do if he needed to pound some nails, or unscrew some bolts and he doesn't happen to have either a hammer or a wrench?
If he didn't have the mental capacity to know how to build in the first place, that wouldn't even be an issue.

But yes, hands are very important. I've stated that already. But the mind is still more important.
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Post by Shadow Wulf »

Exclesia is right, The mind comes first, everything else second.

Your mind tells your hand to hit the nail carefully and try not to injuste your hands. other wise youll be hitting your fingers repeaditly.
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Post by Apokryltaros »

Reilune wrote:
Apokryltaros wrote:Without hands, we would have been unable to do things like utilize, or even make tools.
Tell that to the ravens. I've seen them make things with their beaks.
Our hands allowed us to manipulate our environment, and I assure you, we wouldn't be where we are today if we couldn't do things like pick rocks and throw them at wild animals.
Almost any creature with a mouth can pick up a rock and chuck it at something. It's just doing it with accuracy that's difficult.
When you can show me an example of ravens and or Egyptian vultures crafting spears to bring down cattle, or have them build a structure that is intended to be a metaphorical representation of the universe, I will believe you in that hands are not very important.
Excelsia wrote:
If he didn't have the mental capacity to know how to build in the first place, that wouldn't even be an issue.

But yes, hands are very important. I've stated that already. But the mind is still more important.
If he didn't have mental capacity, he wouldn't have been a carpenter in the first place.
Yes, the mind is important, without it, our greatest achievements would be picking termites out of their mounds with sticks, and eating deer and each other's babies.
What I'm trying to say is that the hand, being controlled by our brains, is the most important tool we humans have.
Ever.
If we didn't have the intellect to control our hands like we do now, we wouldn't be here discussing anything.
What I'm trying to say is that with the hand, we have been able to create everything from egg-spoons to ziggurats to Boeing 747's. And until we learn how to perform telekinesis, the hand will remain the most important tool at our disposal.
Shadow Wulf wrote:Exclesia is right, The mind comes first, everything else second.

Your mind tells your hand to hit the nail carefully and try not to injuste your hands. other wise youll be hitting your fingers repeaditly.
If you didn't have any hands in the first place, you wouldn't have been able to hit anything, at all, in the first place.
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Post by Shadow Wulf »

And you have the knowledge of knowing that the mind controls the hands!! The mind is the most important tool ever is because you can create anything with your mind, your hans just acheves that physicly, with out the mind man would have never thought of anything or even know how to use thier hands well. Its a pure 100% Grade A fact that the mind is the most important thing in your body.
Have you ever heard of the saying "The mind is a terrible thing to waste" But have you ever heard "The hands is a terrible thing to waste"? no, but the hand is still very very important for us to accomplash things that we come up with, Sense Im a drawer I need my hands to draw the stuff, but its my mind thats more important cause Im coming up with the stuff I want to draw, my mind is telling the hand on how to draw it. The hands is the one to follow up my mind. And plus its scientifical. The Mind release electricity that signals the hands to specific instruction.

I sounded smart for a moment thier!! :o :lol:
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Post by Renorei »

Apokryltaros wrote: Yes, the mind is important, without it, our greatest achievements would be picking termites out of their mounds with sticks, and eating deer and each other's babies.
What I'm trying to say is that the hand, being controlled by our brains, is the most important tool we humans have.
Ever.
If we didn't have the intellect to control our hands like we do now, we wouldn't be here discussing anything.
What I'm trying to say is that with the hand, we have been able to create everything from egg-spoons to ziggurats to Boeing 747's. And until we learn how to perform telekinesis, the hand will remain the most important tool at our disposal.

Why are we even arguing? I have never disputed the fact that the hand is the most important tool of the mind. Of course it is. But it is still our mind that operates the hand. The hand is the tool, the mind is the tool-user.
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Post by Set »

Why people underestimate animals to the extent they do is a mystery to me. I've never built a model representing the universe, an airplane, a ziggurat, or a spear for that matter. But that doesn't mean I'm not capable of it, I just don't see the point in wasting my time on it. Same thing with the animals.

Even with your hands, I hightly doubt you could make anything like this if you tried. Termite mounds are quite complicated structures, and you couldn't make one of them either. Egyptian vultures are often documented using rocks as tools to break upen ostrich eggs. You might also want to read about Betty the crow.

So no, hands aren't very importaint. It's the mind that counts.
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Post by Apokryltaros »

Reilune wrote:Why people underestimate animals to the extent they do is a mystery to me. I've never built a model representing the universe, an airplane, a ziggurat, or a spear for that matter. But that doesn't mean I'm not capable of it, I just don't see the point in wasting my time on it. Same thing with the animals.

Even with your hands, I hightly doubt you could make anything like this if you tried. Termite mounds are quite complicated structures, and you couldn't make one of them either. Egyptian vultures are often documented using rocks as tools to break upen ostrich eggs. You might also want to read about Betty the crow.

So no, hands aren't very importaint. It's the mind that counts.
So, in other words, we humans could accomplish what we've accomplished throughout the millenia if we had no hands whatsoever?
Who said I'm underestimating animals?
I'm trying to say that we humans were able to conquer this mudball with our ability to use our hands to craft tools that we thought of.
Yes, I'm well aware of many intelligent animals that have gotten along just peachy keen without the use of any prehensile organs, whatsoever, but I strongly doubt that the ability of Egyptian vultures to learn how to toss rocks at ostriche eggs to break them, or the problem-solving skills of crows and jackdaws, or the instinctive proclivities of termites to build flues, rain-guards,and or heat deflecting and absorbing sides for their mounds, or the ability of birds to weave elaborate nests is going to inspire everyone in the world to cut off their hands and take up basket-weaving with their toes.
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Post by Set »

And who's to say we wouldn't have conquered this mudball without them?

You know what...this really is kind of pointless. I don't feel like bothering with it anymore, so think what you like. I don't care.
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Post by Apokryltaros »

What I'm trying to say is that we wouldn't have gotten anywhere without our hands.
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Post by Lupin »

Jeez. Everyone know that our butt is the most import thing, since without it, we wouldn't be able to sit down or wear pants. Image
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Post by Shadow Wulf »

Nah I think the most important part of the body is the mouth, how would we eat. :pizza:
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Post by Aki »

Shadow Wulf wrote:Nah I think the most important part of the body is the mouth, how would we eat. :pizza:
But..without ze butt, one couldnt dispose of....used.... food.

Then this would happen: :splodey:
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Post by Shadow Wulf »

But!! without ze mouth! You cant !!! swallow food!!

then this will happen :ziplip:

EDIT: my post count says 1992!!! thats when my little buddy was born! :D
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Post by Apokryltaros »

Aki wrote:
Shadow Wulf wrote:Nah I think the most important part of the body is the mouth, how would we eat. :pizza:
But..without ze butt, one couldnt dispose of....used.... food.

Then this would happen: :splodey:
That is true...
Though the larvae of true wasps don't have their digestive tracts completed until they're about to pupate, that is, baby wasps, bees, and ants don't poop until they're ready to end their larval stage. This is because most wasp and bee larvae effectively live in their food, and pooping in it would ruin its edibility.
Shadow Wulf wrote:But!! without ze mouth! You cant !!! swallow food!!

then this will happen :ziplip:

EDIT: my post count says 1992!!! thats when my little buddy was born! :D
Are you going to go for a three hour tour?
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Post by Renorei »

Hands have played a major factor in where we are now. But, right now, in this century, our mind supercedes our hand in importance. I would hate to lose my hands, but if I lost my mind...well, that'd be a lot worse.
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Post by Lupin »

Shadow Wulf wrote:But!! without ze mouth! You cant !!! swallow food!!
How are you going to sit down to eat if you don't have a butt? Plus, there's no point in swallowing food if you can't get rid of it.
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Post by Vilkacis »

Lupin wrote:How are you going to sit down to eat if you don't have a butt? Plus, there's no point in swallowing food if you can't get rid of it.
You could always
:sickpup:

:lol:

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