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What do you think of body symmetry and transformations?
I personaly dont like it when a movie shows a human-to-animal tf scene and have one half of their transforming face wrinkly and sagging, while the other is reletivley normal. Or the 'wolf-boy' in Ginger Snaps 3 *shudders*
Just about everything in nature has a good sense of symmetry to it(living creatures) *shrugs*
And what do you all think of one hand is a paw, while the other is still human? Would the transformation do each body part randomly or will it do things together like both arms, both feet, ect...?

I definately prefer more symmetry. ...all at once, rather than one arm at a time, or somtething bizarre like that. I could imagine one hand shifting a little faster than the other, but not to the extent where one hand is a paw, while the other is almost, or entirely still human.

There is a talented artist who goes my EDMOL who draws transformation images, but one thing I never really liked about his style was his preference for drawing characters this way, with One arm fully changed, but the other completely normal, and a sort of "half way" change in the face, with a portion of the face still completely human. Like this.


I think that the trasformation would begin everywhere at once...but different parts would change at different speeds, so the fur might fully cover the body before it takes on it's new shape, or vice-versa.

I think it might be cool if someones transformation allways began with one part, like maybe his left hand would allways begin to change first, followed soon after by the right and everything else. ...but not to the extent that Edmol does it.

I actually would like it if transformation varied for everyone. Did anyone ever read Animorphs? Remember how when Cassie morphed, her transformations were always beautiful, but everyone else's looked like crap? I could see werewolf transformations being like that. The more skilled you are at TFing (i.e., the longer you've been a werewolf) the more beautiful your transformation will be. Brand new werewolves, however, could be totally asymmetrical and ugly while shifting. Also, I would imagine that, due to their inexperience, they would probably fall over whenever their feet start to shift.

Also, the way I see it, werewolves can shift individual parts of their body. So, a skilled werewolf would be totally in charge of his or her own shift order. If it's cold out, they'd probably grow their fur first. If there is danger nearby, they'd probably grow their claws and muzzles first. You get the idea.

Renorei wrote:
Also, the way I see it, werewolves can shift individual parts of their body. So, a skilled werewolf would be totally in charge of his or her own shift order. If it's cold out, they'd probably grow their fur first. If there is danger nearby, they'd probably grow their claws and muzzles first. You get the idea.

And if a skilled werewolf, in human form, was really happy, he'll grow the tail 1st and wag it like crazy.


Hmmmm....can it work both ways?

Like This.

A werewolf in full wolf form comes to a situation where he needs to write something on paper. But doesn't want to shift to full human form. So he shifts only is paw to a human hand.

Mmm....No...I don't know. Something doesn't seem right about being able to change just one part of your body at a time.

I prefer a more symmetrical change, too. It looks dorky and cartoony if parts suddenly change, without the corresponding part doing it, too. Same with the face. I feel like everything should start changing roughly at the same time. I can imagine maybe one hand or foot or something STARTING the transformation, but it shouldn't change all the way before anything else even starts.

And I just don't like the idea of a werewolf changing his hand back to human. It's just...odd.

Kiba wrote:Mmm....No...I don't know. Something doesn't seem right about being able to change just one part of your body at a time.

Agreed. For some reason it just seems a bit silly. I can't put my finger on why though.

Lupin wrote:

Kiba wrote:Mmm....No...I don't know. Something doesn't seem right about being able to change just one part of your body at a time.

Agreed. For some reason it just seems a bit silly. I can't put my finger on why though.

Admittedly, it's been quite a while since I read the book, but if I recall correctly, McCammon's The Wolf's Hour had shifting of this sort, to a limited degree (you only saw it in one or two places). I think the author did a pretty good job at representing it.

-- Vilkacis

Kiba wrote: And I just don't like the idea of a werewolf changing his hand back to human. It's just...odd.

It is. Thats why I brought it up.

Symmetry is aesthetically pleasing, but it also is more natural. Horror movie experts will be the first to point out that asymmetry is a design element that creates revulsion. (Come to think of it, we've got horror movie experts here on this board.)

Symmetry is more naturally plausible, however. A werewolf shifting asymmetrically strikes me as more at risk for having uneven internal shifting as well, which in places like the brain can be instantly lethal. Still, I like the shock value image of someone with recently acquired lycanthropy turning his or her head, doing the Locutus bit, with one eye reflecting light and fur erupting on one side first as they break the news.

Renorei wrote:I actually would like it if transformation varied for everyone.

I'd have to agree with you on this, but I personally don't like the just shifting one bodypart thing. It seems odd to me.

I don't really have anything to add here except my agreement. A symmetrical shift is the best unless you are going for revulsion, and I do like the idea of some having more attractive shifts than others much like in Animorphs. It might even be considered an art form like in that series.

Figarou wrote:A werewolf in full wolf form comes to a situation where he needs to write something on paper. But doesn't want to shift to full human form. So he shifts only is paw to a human hand.

I don't think that would work terribly well. I imagine a human hand wouldn't sit very well in a humongous, bulky werewolf arm/frontleg. It would be awkward and maybe even painful. So in order to use the wrist properly, the WW would have to transform also his forearm, but then it wouldn't fit properly to his upper arm, so he'd have to change that too, but then it wouldn't be too comfortable for his shoulder etc. etc.
So it becomes a daisy-chain.

In regards to the shifting one body part thing:

I agree that it most certainly is very, very weird. But...I don't think it would be scientifically impossible. Furthermore, as stated, it would have to be an experienced shifter that could do this.

I think the main reason many of you seem to be against this idea is because it would be weird to see stuff like a full wolf growing a human hand in a movie, or a human's head suddenly becoming wolven while the rest of his body remained human. Rest assured, I agree that I don't think I'd want to see that in a film. I wouldn't mind reading about it in a novel, but a visual presentation of said occurence could be a little creepy, and probably wouldn't come across very well. If werewolves in a movie had the ability to shift individual body parts, this ability would have to be handled very tactfully, from a cinematic perspective. Stuff that looks downright freaky and just plain wrong should be avoid (aforementioned examples). However, little things that wouldn't be too disturbing could be used. Like maybe a wolf or gestalt shifting his eyes to human to be able to utilize the superior human vision. Or a wolf or gestalt shifting his tongue and vocal cords to be able to make some speech. Or perhaps a gestalt growing human hands for a delicate task (note: this would be much less freaky than if it were a fully wolf, because the gestalt body is humanoid). Or maybe a human growing gestalt hands (which Jack seems to be doing in the trailer). Or shifting the gestalt shoulders to allow for four legged running (which we have established will be done). Instances such as these are examples of things that I think a film could pull off, without seeming too strange, in regards to the shifting of individual body parts. Ultimately though, I see no reason why this isn't possible, so I suppose it's merely a matter of preference.


In regards to being able to choose their own shift order:

I see this as being even less weird and even more within the range of possibility, especially for an experienced werewolf, than the previously discussed situation. After all, even though they may be choosing to shift one part of their body first, the rest of their body will shortly follow. The weird factor is substantially reduced.


Honestly though, I doubt either of these issues will come into play in Freeborn.

I think that a WereWolf should be able to stop a transfromation at any point they choose if they are expirenced enough. For example, a furry person with long-ish teeth & a little hunched over. Another example, a wolf that's taller than normal & appears to have long arms/forepaws/ compared to the rest of it's body. But, agreeingly, not just one part of a WereWolf can transform at once. L8er!!!

Part of the fun of lycanthropy IS the weird factor, the things that most people don't think about. Imagine licking your own nose with a broad, flat canine tongue and then moments later realizing that that's strange. It goes more for the heart of the horror aspect than turning into a guy in a gorilla suit with an obviously fake mask, because it looks and feels plausible.

Scott Gardener wrote:Part of the fun of lycanthropy IS the weird factor, the things that most people don't think about. Imagine licking your own nose with a broad, flat canine tongue and then moments later realizing that that's strange. It goes more for the heart of the horror aspect than turning into a guy in a gorilla suit with an obviously fake mask, because it looks and feels plausible.

Actually, I'm all in favor of plenty of weirdness. However, I was giving examples of how shifting individual body parts might not be too weird, since many people seem to be opposed to the shifting of individual parts because of the weirdness factor.

My real isssue with it isn't so much that it seems odd in and of itself, it's just that it can be if not done a certain way. I don't want to see werewolves that look like patchwork creatures or Frankenstein monsters.

I guess it also depends on what bodyparts the were would be shifting and whether or not they would be going from human to wolf or wolf to human. If for example (yes, I'm stealing one of yours) a were in human form changes his head to that of a wolf it has the potential to be really freakin' cool. On the other paw, if that same were was in gestalt or full wolf forms and shifted only his head back to human it would be very bizarre indeed.

Or say if a werewolf only changed two of his toes to or from paws. I couldn't see a reason for that but I think you get the point.

Anyway I'm not against it entirely. I'm just against it being badly done.

Set wrote:My real isssue with it isn't so much that it seems odd in and of itself, it's just that it can be if not done a certain way. I don't want to see werewolves that look like patchwork creatures or Frankenstein monsters.

I guess it also depends on what bodyparts the were would be shifting and whether or not they would be going from human to wolf or wolf to human. If for example (yes, I'm stealing one of yours) a were in human form changes his head to that of a wolf it has the potential to be really freakin' cool. On the other paw, if that same were was in gestalt or full wolf forms and shifted only his head back to human it would be very bizarre indeed.

Or say if a werewolf only changed two of his toes to or from paws. I couldn't see a reason for that but I think you get the point.

Anyway I'm not against it entirely. I'm just against it being badly done.

Cool. Then I think we are mostly in agreement. While I'm not opposed to freaky combinations of body parts, I agree that I would definitely prefer it to be well done, in such a way that it doesn't look absurd. If werewolves are to be given this ability in a film, the filmakers would have to ensure that it doesn't look unnatural and disturbing.

Yeah I prefer the symetry TF more. Seems more natural...

I like the Symmetry. I dont think it would be ably to walk to good with one paw and a half foot.

Yeah, symmetry is pretty common in development of organisms in nature. Therefore, it would be, IMO, reasonable to conclude that any shifting would also be symmetrical (then again, I dunno about "focused" shifts that are limited to one body part).

Veruth's 'asymmetrical revulsion' is a good point. This isn't going to be a horror movie, so there's no real reason to go for unnatural effects.

All the talk about single-part shifting just makes me think of Whitewolf (of course), where such things are a mainstay of advanced gifts. Personally, I'd be more inclined to think that highly experienced (I can't stress that enough) werewolves might be able to phase their shifting so that, rather than shifting their hand all the way, they can grow their fangs out, bulk up, get hairier and more intimidating, without going completely fuzzy. I doubt even all werewolves could do that, though, even with practice. It'd be like being double-jointed or ambidextrous, methinks.

I find myself being in favor of symmetry for many of the reasons that have already been stated. I also agree with the fact that if shifting of one part of the body is well done it shouldn't be a problem. I think even a werewolf shifting his paw back into a human hand could potentialy be a distrubing yet cool effect.