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I know a lot of folks talk 'puberty'.. but what are other possabilities.?

AB

Another possibility could be how quickly that werewolf grows after being born.

Wolves in real life develop faster compared to a human. Add that element and you can have a werewolf being able to change at an early age.

I'm thinking 3-6 years old would be the average.

What about body structure? A werewolf in human form, has a body similar to that of a human. IMO, I think earlier isn't possible due to the fact of the energy required to change and grow. At a young age, humans need to eat in order to aquire the neccesary ingredients for growth and developement. If the same rule applies to werewolves, they would need to eat a lot inorder to fill the ingredent need for both human and wolf forms, which is A LOT OF FOOD. And when they did change, they would need to consume a lot of food to power the change.

BlackWolfDS wrote:What about body structure? A werewolf in human form, has a body similar to that of a human. IMO, I think earlier isn't possible due to the fact of the energy required to change and grow. At a young age, humans need to eat in order to aquire the neccesary ingredients for growth and developement. If the same rule applies to werewolves, they would need to eat a lot inorder to fill the ingredent need for both human and wolf forms, which is A LOT OF FOOD. And when they did change, they would need to consume a lot of food to power the change.

Does a werewolf REALLY NEED to eat a lot of food to get energy?

There are some foods out there that can give us quick energy from small amounts.

It'll be silly to see a young werewolf eat an entire cow just so it can grow.

An entire cow is a bit much. If someone ate more than they needed, the body would either store it as fat or have the unused nutrients pass throught the body. I was thinking that a young werewolf would probably have to eat twice that of a normal human child, just to stay healthy and maintain their growth. As for the quick energy....that to me sounds like sugar. If it gives you quick energy, it will most likely give you a sugar crash which will end in sleep or drowsiness. But that's all IMO.

BlackWolfDS wrote:An entire cow is a bit much. If someone ate more than they needed, the body would either store it as fat or have the unused nutrients pass throught the body. I was thinking that a young werewolf would probably have to eat twice that of a normal human child, just to stay healthy and maintain their growth. As for the quick energy....that to me sounds like sugar. If it gives you quick energy, it will most likely give you a sugar crash which will end in sleep or drowsiness. But that's all IMO.

well....there is this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbohydrate

Figarou wrote:

BlackWolfDS wrote:An entire cow is a bit much. If someone ate more than they needed, the body would either store it as fat or have the unused nutrients pass throught the body. I was thinking that a young werewolf would probably have to eat twice that of a normal human child, just to stay healthy and maintain their growth. As for the quick energy....that to me sounds like sugar. If it gives you quick energy, it will most likely give you a sugar crash which will end in sleep or drowsiness. But that's all IMO.

well....there is this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbohydrate

Note: Rice is a source of carbohydrate. ;3

Figarou wrote:
well....there is this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbohydrate

.....yeah there's that too

My werewolves shift at birth--and even in fetal development. They age at human rates, regardless of what form they spend most of their time in.

As with all scenarios, I feel this would vary depending on the setting and genre of the story they exist in.

I will say that I am not fond of the "dormancy before puberty" scenario, but also don't like them to be shifting too near birth, so this is a very good question.

When would thier first shift be? Hmmmmmm...

What occurs to me now is that the impact of the lycanthropy could "Mature" with thier bodies.

Perhaps, they might begin having mini, partial transformations as early as 12-months, (like sudden appearing, and vanishing body hair or larger teeth, yellow eyes, mildly shifting bonestructure, off and on wolf-senses, etc.) at the times that it is normal for the werewolves to change as well as irregular times as thier bodies are not quite stable yet.

(If a baby can't help but make a mess in it's diaper, and can go from bliss to screaming rage in an isntant about things as common as feeling cold or hungry, it is conceivable to think that they may set off thier genetic "gift" by mistake from time to time.)

As they get older, the magnatude and regularity of these small changes would steadily grow, and they would not really change "all the way" untill they are full grown adults.

(maybe a pre-teen werewolf might look comparable to "Teen-Wolf")

By this same logic, "ELDER" werewolves might even look more fantastic, and less human than a 18-30 year old one durring thier transformations.

...that is one possibility anyway.

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On the other hand, I really like the Werewolf Pups in "Camp Lycanthrope", which obviously requires things to work differently.

Generally speaking though... I think changes should begin After infancy, and Before puberty, but be more significant durring adulthood.

The earliest I can picture a Full Transformation into either Gestalt or Wolf would be 5-years old, but probably more like 9-12 with "Bar-Fight" like partial changes as early as 2-1/2 to 4. ...maybe...

No earlier than 18 years old. You are still growing as a human mentally and physically up to really about 21. So the transforming could have weird side effects on a growing person. Not to mention the social aspects to that. Going through puberty as a werewolf able to transform could be possibly hectic. Raging hormones etc. Probably wouldn't be pretty.

My first scenario is based primarily on the assumtion that Lycanthropy is a biological phenominon.

In an entirely different scenario, where werewolves are created by magic, curses, gifts granted as favors in return for serving a powerful god/spirit of some kind, or some other supernatural origin, I think most of the laws of biology would take a back seat.


If a supernatural power is applied to the task of transforming a person into a wolf, then I believe that the task would be completed 100% regardless of the current status or age of the human. Teens and Adults would entirely become wolves (or whatever variant creature the magic creates), children and toddlers would become Pups/Cubs, and in such mystical scenarios, I also think that a fetus could be transformed from human to wolf, still within the womb of a mother...perhaps or perhaps not, to some potential harm and discomfort to her in the proccess.


I am opposed to placing the first shift at or after puberty because the scenario of someone being a werewolf since the day they were born but never showing even the slightest sign of it before that very moment is such a *rolls eyes* groan worthy plot device...especially when placed in the midst of puberty and teen-angst.

Having had time to slowly adjust to it from an earlier age, rather than having it be completely turned off for the first two decades of thier life and suddenly being hit with it all at once seems much more psychologically healthy to me.

As for it being dangerous for youth...yeah...it would be. Since when has Lycanthropy supposed to have been kind and healthy for a person? "Early Lycanthrope Death/Disfiguration Syndrome" sounds like a very realistic sort of occurance to me. ...and a good reason to think twice about having children if you are a werewolf...which would be a plausable, partial explanation for why they remain so rare and do not comprise a significant portion of the world population.

Well my weres don't shift until after they're weaned, with the average first shift occuring at or after age 3. I'm not saying they have a hell of a lot of control over it, though.

I'm of the opinion shifting in and of itself doesn't kill people, but being a werewolf does pose some health risks. (Like a damn HUGE increase in the chance of them getting cancer - with cell division that rapid, even mild regenerative abilities would up the chance significantly.) The little ones wouldn't die from the shift. I don't see them shifting that often though.

Werewolf children might actually turn out to be smaller than the other kids, even once they're fully grown, on account of the shifting taking up extra energy. Sooo...no huge werewolves, not for the ones who are born. No way in hell.

Oddly enough I don't like the puberty angle. As the human body is changing. I actually agree more with the early twenties when normal human growth starts and maybe have this as the time for the next metamorphisis to begin. But still have other abilities or lesser transformation abilities prior to this time just no full out man-beast or full-beast transformations.

It depends on what else you accept about lycanthropy.

If lycanthropy only comes in one variation (werewolf) that matures naturally in one set pattern, I'd set lycanthropic maturity to occur at 6-13.

If, on the other hand, lycanthropy becomes completely dormant at birth and may mature into a completely different form of lycanthropy as it develops (weretiger, etc.), I'd say it would average between 13-21 but could take longer.

early years of the pups life....i guess the earlier the better....

I like the puberty thing, it's plain and simple.

First I thought hmm why not at birth, and then i thought, the early stages of birth the child can not be expected to have the energy a virus, or what ever, needs to preform such a change.

Then I thought maybe 1-8 years old, but then I thought, a child that young would easily hurt themselves ie trips and claw ends up stabing the throut, plus the lack of size and muscle/bone structure to use

So I ended up with the idea that the time of puberty would be best. After all that's when all those growths sperts hit, and let's face it teenagers eat enough for the energy.

Vuldari wrote: I am opposed to placing the first shift at or after puberty because the scenario of someone being a werewolf since the day they were born but never showing even the slightest sign of it before that very moment is such a *rolls eyes* groan worthy plot device...especially when placed in the midst of puberty and teen-angst.

Having had time to slowly adjust to it from an earlier age, rather than having it be completely turned off for the first two decades of thier life and suddenly being hit with it all at once seems much more psychologically healthy to me.

As for it being dangerous for youth...yeah...it would be. Since when has Lycanthropy supposed to have been kind and healthy for a person? "Early Lycanthrope Death/Disfiguration Syndrome" sounds like a very realistic sort of occurance to me. ...and a good reason to think twice about having children if you are a werewolf...which would be a plausable, partial explanation for why they remain so rare and do not comprise a significant portion of the world population.

I agree to a degree on the supernatural part. Its magic, anything can pretty much go. But, as for the whole psychological aspect. It wouldn't be traumatic unless the person didn't know. I mean if your parents are werewolves what are the problems with telling your kid. No psychological stress if you already knew. Ya know?

In the story I wrote, the Change in Lineage Were's is a slow, gradual thing. It takes around Sixteen years to be complete.
From birth to age ten or so, the only difference between a Were' child and a Smooth child is that the Were' youngster doesn't get sick, and heals fast: faster as they get older. First to change are the Ears, somewhere between the ages of nine and eleven. Then the Teeth: as the child set of teeth are replaced by the adult set, the teeth that grow in are Wulfen, not Smooth: ie; Johnny's got some pointies now, instead of the flatties his friends have. Puberty brings on several of the Werewolf changes, the feet, the nails, the hair, and the reproductive bits come in Wulfen instead of as Smooth (Human). Somewhere around the age of Sixteen, or on the Sixteenth Birthday; the youngster does a strip-and-show, or he/she undresses in front of several witnesses and shows the Were' gifts: Teeth, ears, feet, claw-nails, tail stub (like a greyhound's tail) then proceeds to do his/her first formal Shift. The process must be smooth and in proper sequence and he/she must be able to do this within a three-minute timeframe. The new Wolf is then quizzed on the Law, the Lore, proper manners, and must maintain their control with precision. At this young age, getting frightened can cause a panic Reversal, and leave the new Wolf back in Smooth, and unable to shift for a time.
If the youngster manages to do everything right, they are then recorded as an adult Wolf, and are considered to be adult within the Kindred (that includes mating, joining, giving an Oath, being considered as an adult, if a young one). At this time, their Markings are also recorded.
It's sort of like a Bar/Bas Mitzvah, only with Fur and Teeth. "Crossing", on the other hand does all this in approximately a week (Were' making).
Now, all I have to do is get "Wulfen Blood" published...and I'm working on that.

((Tell me when it's going to be published, because that sounds like a cool book))

Ok, I want to clearify something I said eariler. I said (IMO) that it wouldn't be possible for a child to change at an earily age. I never specified with the age part, as in what age? I would say that a child can transform, not a baby. That's what I was thinking of when I typed my earlier post, my bad.

Anyway, why wouldn't a Change happen earily? I mean at like the age of 5, 6 or 7. A child werewolf makes some sense. When your an adult and something dramatic happens to you, you tend to.....well, you know exactly what happend and that tends to impact you more. In the world of werewolves, this could happen too...but then someone else could argue that by the time one was 18 or whenever, they have mentally preped themselves for the transformation.

Now as a child, you could take it two ways and possible more. (1) you could be scared for life and would not fuction like a normal being. (2) you could find it interesting and possibley fun. Children love to pretend and play. Why wouldn't a werewolf cub do the same and play? Those animal insticts that a Werewolf cub would inherite, would probably be most like a real wolf cub; Curious, playful and mystivious(SP?).

Now reading back on what I have said....acually is confusing.
I think this topic is to controversal because of the absents of facts. *sigh*

neoritter wrote:It wouldn't be traumatic unless the person didn't know. I mean if your parents are werewolves what are the problems with telling your kid. No psychological stress if you already knew. Ya know?

Right...just like it is not stressful, traumatic or emotionally taxing at all for a Mother-To-Be as she looks at the date she marked on her callendar which her doctor told her is the most likely time she will give birth to her first child.

...knowing exactly what is going to happen eventually...but not quite knowing the exact day or time...

...could it be early?...could it be late?...

She's heard how painful it can be, and has been training for weeks to be ready for it...which possibly makes it even MORE frigtening to think all that is needed. ...plus morphine...


*sarcasm* Yep...Knowing what is going to happen makes it not stressful or traumatic at all... */sarcasm*


...that is my opinion on the likely effects of the event anyway.

History and Science has shown that young children adapt to new things far more quickly and easily than adults. ...or so I've seen, and have been told.

Born werewolves should shift from birth, and even in the womb, IMO. In addition, the shifting shouldn't be nearly as stressful (or even stressful at all) as it is for a new adult werewolf, because they've been that way their whole lives. Shifting would be practically painless, and really easy.

Also, born werewolves probably grow up healthier, stronger, fitter, and bigger than average humans. Regenerative abilities + other cool stuff that comes with being a werewolf = yay!

Personally, I've always thought that the stance that werewolves shift at puberty was terribly retarded and cliche. IT'S BECUZ OF TEH HOORMONES. Please. Give me a break.


Anyway, none of my views are based in science, they're just based on what I think would be cool. Do not attempt to argue with me, as there is honestly no scientific argument to be made at all, since none of this is even remotely possible. Basically it would go something like: BUT THIS IS WHAT I LIKE!!! NO, THIS IS WHAT I LIEK IT'S BETTER!!!

Part of the reason I left this place for so long was because of all the ridiculous bickering. God, why can't someone just say what they like without having someone crawling all over their back throwing out ridiculous reasons why they're wrong? Ugh.

Renorei! From this point on ALL your oppinions are REJECTED!!

j/k

No but supringly, you and I share almost the same idea of a werewolf.

Shadow Wulf wrote: No but supringly, you and I share almost the same idea of a werewolf.

Yeah, I've always felt that your opinion on werewolves and mine were nearly identical.

Heh heh, that's why I've always like yours.