THE PACK Message Boards

Wait, are the PETArds doing the bill to stop breeding, or the petition against it?

And, why don' t the PETArds understand that animals killing other animals is a fact of nature and try not to gloss it over with their Disney view of nature. At least when we learn to grow meat in a lab, the vegetarians will lose their moral superiority.

All radical groups suck. You need to stay out of other people's business.

Agreed,

I wish these fruity treehugers would get over them selves! They think they are so moraly supirior, that they feel that they have to shove their bull s*** down our throats!

PETA, GREEN PEACE, and any extremist tree huger.... SHUT THE F**K UP!

We shouldn't condemn all animal rights activists just because of the radical ones. What about the ones that aren't so crazy, the ones that actually do some good (Like the ASPCA, unless I'm misinformed)

Dreamer wrote:We shouldn't condemn all animal rights activists just because of the radical ones. What about the ones that aren't so crazy, the ones that actually do some good (Like the ASPCA, unless I'm misinformed)

Very true,

but we are talking about the radicals that feel like they have to alienate every man, woman, and child for their weird agendas.

What's worse are those uber-environmentalists that set fire to homes under construction or vandalize Hummer dealerships because they think that's how to save the planet.

PFFT! Just for them, i'm gonna burn up irreplacable fossil fuels, chop down a redwood tree, and litter til I die. When are people gonna understrand the more aggressive you get with your causes, the more you turn people away from them?

SHEESH.

PETA's retarded.

Ugh, those people.

This truly is the dumbest thing I've heard of in quite some time.

DarkShadow wrote:PETA's retarded.

nuff said

Ugh, peta. Bunch of misinformed radical nutcakey... My god I hope they all get diseases that can only be cured by animal research.







...well, okay, not really... But it would be deliciously ironic if they did...

MattSullivan wrote:What's worse are those uber-environmentalists that set fire to homes under construction or vandalize Hummer dealerships because they think that's how to save the planet.

PFFT! Just for them, i'm gonna burn up irreplacable fossil fuels, chop down a redwood tree, and litter til I die. When are people gonna understrand the more aggressive you get with your causes, the more you turn people away from them?

SHEESH.

You know what's funny about that? Burning a Hummer will put out 10 times more toxic emmissions that the Hummer would have created in its entire functioning lifespan.

Hey, those guys who burnt the SUVs are from my town. They just got their sentences. You should have read the blatherskite going around the local free weekly and the local paper, leading up to the sentencing. The mother of the Number One Suspect even wrote the editorial page asking Eugene to forgive her son. No joke, some of the people speaking up for the defendants said they're gentle, non-violent people.

............

You know what those mouth-breathers did? They burnt up a police substation in one of the bad sections of town "to practice." They also had a nasty habit of ostracizing and threatening people of their acquaintance, that got an ounce of conscience when the subject of bombs was bandied. I'm sorry, but gentle, non-violent people don't threaten honest people to keep them from speaking out, and blow up cop shops.

I blogged on the trial a few months ago. I said that if they really wanted to save trees in Eugene, instead of doing tree-sittings, they could have harvested the seeds from the trees and planted them. Much better use of ammonium nitrate, I should think.

PETA is an extremely radical organization. Unless I am mistaken, they fund a known terrorist group known as ALF (Animal Liberation Front), responsible of the killing a security guard when they burned down a tree nursery.

You just know that an organization is too far one way when they're funding groups on America's terrorist wanted lists.

In addition to that - most organizations that label themselves a 'front', such as the ALF, consider themselves to be on a battlefield. 'Front' is a term used to describe an area of active battle (so to speak). Aaaand, it's 3:30 AM and my brain is tired. Some people take it to mean that if they are involved in a 'war', then they all of a sudden have a license to 'kill' the 'enemy'. Sometimes the best answers I get is when I meet a member of one of these organizations, they try to recruit me and I ask: "So, where did you pick up the license to kill?".

The answers I get are sometimes to die for.

Would love to hear them and compare to the "defenses" I hear sometimes.

The big chestnut that everyone was chewing on here in Eugene regarding the Operation Backfire defendants (now convicts) was "The bombings were non-violent because nobody was injured or killed in them and the bombers made sure nobody was in the buildings when they hit them."

That's "blame the victim" syndrome. If you'd done as he told you and didn't piss him off he wouldn't have beaten you.

I wanted to write the editor and say, "Why isn't anyone acknowledging that the perps used BOMBS?" Bombs are violent. They're not instruments of peace (unless you count the peace of the grave). I have billions of war veterans, living and dead, ready to back me up on that. I thought the point of the exercise was to eschew bombs, right?

Quoth Pogo Possum: "Bombs is not good. They put everything to everywhere."

Ashkin-Tyr wrote:PETA is an extremely radical organization. Unless I am mistaken, they fund a known terrorist group known as ALF (Animal Liberation Front), responsible of the killing a security guard when they burned down a tree nursery.

Now that's just nuts. Since when did trees pose a threat to animals? Were they pissed about the earthworms and gophers that got nixed when the fields were ploughed to plant the trees?

So now ALF do have a body-count. They've been talking about it for awhile, looks like someone got Wyrmish enough to take the last step and cross the line.

vrikasatma wrote:Now that's just nuts. Since when did trees pose a threat to animals? Were they pissed about the earthworms and gophers that got nixed when the fields were ploughed to plant the trees?

So now ALF do have a body-count. They've been talking about it for awhile, looks like someone got Wyrmish enough to take the last step and cross the line.

It had to do with the trees being "hybrids" I believe. However, ELF (Earth Liberation Front) (ALF's sister group) has set fire to numerous nurseries on several occasions because, and I quote, "You cannot control what is wild".

Interestingly enough, these organizations, which claim they are “peaceful”, have a tendency for extremely violent acts. Coincidently, they are responsible for the biggest act of eco-terrorism. They set fire to an apartment complex in San Diego to "protest urban sprawl". Luckily, everyone was evacuated before the building completely burned to the ground.

Even I draw the line with the ALF and ELF. (Hard not to think of Wendy Pini hanging out with an eighties sitcom puppet.) There are radicals of every philosophy, and my own is no exception. I will not sanction terrorism and violence, not even to defend my own causes. I may not eat chicken or beef, but I'm not going to stop everyone else from enjoying their meal, and I certainly will not support blowing up a McDonald's. I'd be the first to turn in to the authorities the party responsible. Looneys and radicals ruin the reputation of the legitimate movements. Anyone you know in the U.S. converted to Islam shortly after the 9/11 attacks? Instead, legitimate mosques and muslims had to deal with substantial religious intolerance. Same goes for violent animal rights activism. I'm glad someone's actually noticing what I consider one of the most overriding and underaddressed ethical issues on the planet, but I'd rather it be someone who could just as easily be an Iraq insurgency suicide bomber.

I eat meat, but I don't eat beef or deep fried anything. I don't drink soda, either. When on the off chance I do patronize a McDonald's, it's to get the yoghurt parfait they serve. They're getting better — a damn sight better than Taco Bell, KFC (remember when they were Kentucky Fried Chicken?) and Burger King — and with any luck, they'll sway the fast food industry towards a more healthy line of offerings. (I don't like how they add high fructose corn syrup to their chocolate milk...sweetened milk is kind of like gilding the lily)

It's just better to tell people the truth about what they're eating so they can either a) make an informed decision and act on it, or b) you've removed their last excuse and they can't beg ignorance anymore.

I'm not going to go on about "Liberals" (they aren't) and modern child-raising and all the old saws that people use...

Simple fact: People have done this sort of thing forever; pick a cause, and it's been used: as an excuse. These people, for all their excessive rhetoric, are no different from the people who started the Nazi party, or Pol Pot's political genocides, or massacred the Hugeonots, or would ride out and massacre indians just for the fun of it.

They are simply Evil. Lots of people see them as "somebody finally doing something" and ignore the fact they are being just as destructuve as they can be: because they WANT to. Evil has a cachet, nowadays; because it's active, while Good is frequently passive; or so slow to act that it seems that way. That doesn't change the fact that they have turned against their society and their people to do what can only be called Evil.

They make claims; but their actions show their focus: destruction, supression, dominance over others-and the "Planet" or the "Animals" are just camouflage. They want to destroy; to conquer, to control.

They belong in prison, where they cannot do more damage. You don't bring change this way-you only bring destruction... If you want to do Good, you don't destroy...you build.

Red-Eye, you summed the whole issue up <u>perfectly</u>.

I was angry when the Cavel West slaughterhouse got burnt to the ground, not because I support horse slaughter (as the perps and their supporters might claim) but because it undercuts the <i>legitimate</i> and <i>legal</i> work within the system to close down not just that particular plant, but make horse slaughter <i>illegal</i> and therefore banned in this country. Supporters of horse slaughter — and there are more than you'd think — could falsely accuse the End Horse Slaughter movement of being in collusion with these snarling chimpanzees and putting them up to it. That is everything but the case.

When I read about the bust and the actions leading up to it, the thought of "This is the kind of s*** gangs get up to" kept coming to mind. ALF and ELF aren't cults — they're gangs, pure and simple.

Thank-you, Vrikasatma. People like this teach us a lesson: We see them and we want to "serve them some of their own"...

Old saying: "The evil strongest in you is the evil that angers you most in others."

That being said...I wouldn't mind being able to "fuzz up" and go make some trouble for them, anyhow.

But...we all know that ain't possible; so I'll have to settle for making trouble for the evil in me...

Dammit- I never get to have any fun. (sigh)

Here's something really funny. I ran a Werewolf:the Apocalypse game at Baycon. The story was that the character pack were on a whale-watching trip off the coast of Northern California and chanced across a scene of an orca pod attacking a baby grey whale.

Most of the watchers were uncomfortable but one woman went ballistic, screaming at the orcas to stop killing the baby whale. The pack's Child of Gaia Theurge (with the Soft-Hearted flaw) talked her down. The ship went back to land and they all went home and forgot about it...

Until a few weeks later, when orca parts started washing up on the local beaches.

Now, this is the World of Darkness and things are obviously a good deal darker than in real life, so please no "you're painting these guys with too broad a paint brush" accusations. It's a game. That said...I have a faction called the Animal Protection League (APL). That's the nice, soft, puppy-dog-eyes front but deeper in the organization there's crawling, hideous corruption residing in the militant branch. I patterned these guys on the Sea Shepherd Society and ALF and gave them an old Russian diesel submarine, complete with torpedoes. What happened in the story was the woman who went bonkers on the boat got ashore, and thought, "Oh, this is horrible. It's got to stop. Hey, I heard about the Animal Protection League, maybe they can suggest what to do next" and went to their office in San Francisco.

Well, obviously, they did know what to do next and that was sound out their militant branch to go kill the orca pod "for the good of the gentle baleen whales" and the parts washing up on NorCal beaches was the direct result of that "action."

The delicious irony of the whole thing is that the Garou are supposed to be Earth's defenders from ecological disaster so there's a number of Garou involved in the APL, mostly in the militant branch. One of the Garou in this particular APL cell is the grand elder of the characters' Sept, a Fenrir Forseti. It's a classic "whom do you serve, Goddess or King?" dilemma without a Black Spiral Dancer, fomor or Nexus Crawler in sight. It's *all* Gaian Garou, and in a way veers close to the "band of brothers" zeitgeist of Werewolf:the Forsaken and weaves the thread of good intentions gone horribly wrong.

By the way, the scene of a boatful of whale watchers witnessing an orca pack killing a baby grey whale on migration and screaming at them to stop is based on an actual occurence. It happened a few years ago in the Bay Area. I find it disgusting that people have grown so far from nature that they want it to stop for the sake of their sensibilities.

Always respect an animal just as much as humans, even after death and consumption. Lack of respect will bring in rotten meat, for diseased organisms to die with.

Have i said anything wrong yet?