Examples how NOT to do it!

[Moonstalker]

Everybody has seen a werewolf movie with a reaction "oh please, not like this!"

I watched The Howling just a few minutes ago and I had that kinda reaction. The werewolves were two legged rats and their fur looked like they live in sewers. Not to mention the shifting was probaply the most ugliest thing I've ever seen. I understand the movie ain't very new but I think it is a perfect example for what the Freeborn shouldn't be.

More examples or ideas for this topic?

[Scott Gardener]

For it's time, though, The Howling was pretty influential. Right up to 1981, when it came out, we were had decades of Lon Chaney look-alikes. The Howling laid important groundwork for the Gestalt form we know and love today--digitigrade stance, extended muzzles, pointy ears, and a lot of other things we take for granted. The problems you're seeing is mainly because special effects in 1981 didn't have CGI or quite as massive studio effects branches to back it up. Granted, American Werewolf in London came out that same year, and its special effects in terms of shifting remains a benchmark standard today.

Still, you young whipper-snappers have no idea how important some of these works are. Kids these days, calling the original Star Wars slow-paced, with cheesy effects...

[Fullmoonstar]

For it's time, though, The Howling was pretty influential. Right up to 1981, when it came out, we were had decades of Lon Chaney look-alikes. The Howling laid important groundwork for the Gestalt form we know and love today--digitigrade stance, extended muzzles, pointy ears, and a lot of other things we take for granted. The problems you're seeing is mainly because special effects in 1981 didn't have CGI or quite as massive studio effects branches to back it up. Granted, American Werewolf in London came out that same year, and its special effects in terms of shifting remains a benchmark standard today.

Still, you young whipper-snappers have no idea how important some of these works are. Kids these days, calling the original Star Wars slow-paced, with cheesy effects...

I totally have to agree with that... The Howling was a very important, influential Movies for most of the Werewolffilms...

[Black Claw]

Yeah, i'll tell another werewolf movie i think was good, Bad Moon.

[Howlitzer]

Still, you young whipper-snappers have no idea how important some of these works are. Kids these days, calling the original Star Wars slow-paced, with cheesy effects...

Hey, I respect The Howling and AWIL....especially AWIL.

but I'm not gonna lie....I unburied some VHS copies of the original Star Wars last summer, having only vaguely remembered watching them when I was like 6.....And I remembered them being slightly better than they seemed upon watching them again.

[MattSullivan]

Young kids these days all have ADD. That's why they would see STAR WARS as "slow" Yeesh.

But you guys have to remember 98% of the world still sees the Werewolf film as horror. They are not part of this board. The werewolf fandom in but a small microcosm of pop culture. it's gonna take that ONE good character driven werewolf film with APPEALLING looking lycanthropes to really win over that crowd.


In the meantime, the HOWLING is a classic horror film on its own, if you try to look part the fact that the werewolf isn't "pretty"

[Howlitzer]

Young kids these days all have ADD

<crazed rant> Young kids are SUPPOSED to have ADD! Gah!

Ritalin...pshhhh....

I should be the one to talk....I was caught in the ADD scare and a pediatrician (who should be shot btw) pretty much forced my parents into putting me on Ritalin at the age of 6, followed by numerous other ADD medications....and it took until 4th grade to have a doctor conclude that I did *not* have ADD, but that like any small child I had a less-than-exemplary attention span.

Here's what happened: The Ritalin worked for about 2 weeks, then completely backfired. The other meds worked for similar periods of time, then completely backfired. Among other things I apparently had hallucinations, really disturbing nightmares on a regular basis, had short term blackouts, and now I have pretty much blocked out all of elementary school save for a few random memories that confirm most of the weird crap that people say happened when I was going through this.

So...mess with their brain chemistry and put a kid through THAT, or simply put up with their short attention span until they grow out of it
</crazed rant>

sorry....touchy subject with me.


back to the movies >.<

[Irish Wolf]

Young kids these days all have ADD. That's why they would see STAR WARS as "slow" Yeesh.

I'm 13 and when i watched A New Hope i never thought it was slow paced.

Moving on. I know that Harry Potter isn't a werewolf movie but still the comb-over werewolf was horrible.

[Kelpten]

But you guys have to remember 98% of the world still sees the Werewolf film as horror. They are not part of this board. The werewolf fandom in but a small microcosm of pop culture. it's gonna take that ONE good character driven werewolf film with APPEALLING looking lycanthropes to really win over that crowd.

Ya, what Matt said. Freeborn is the first movie made by werewolf fans that want something very different. If we do it right, we'll completely reset the peramiters of the the genre. The closest werewolf movie I can think of to freeborn was Blood and Chocolate, but even there the werewolves were evil, and only the main character was an exception.

But special effects are important, since they can make or break a movie in today's high expectaions. But at the same time, let's not forget the importance of plot (Star wars episode 1 had great effects, but no plot or characterization or acting or...)

[Moonstalker]

Young kids these days all have ADD. That's why they would see STAR WARS as "slow" Yeesh.

But you guys have to remember 98% of the world still sees the Werewolf film as horror. They are not part of this board. The werewolf fandom in but a small microcosm of pop culture. it's gonna take that ONE good character driven werewolf film with APPEALLING looking lycanthropes to really win over that crowd.


In the meantime, the HOWLING is a classic horror film on its own, if you try to look part the fact that the werewolf isn't "pretty"

Actually I've never seen a werewolf movie where the werewolf was "pretty". At this far closest is in Van Helsing, though it ain't best as it could be. Anyway it is best at this far.

[Night_Hunter]

true

there should be more movies where the werewolves should look cool

but i think they aren't because werewolves in movies are never portrayed as the good guys or the heroes. Then they show them as monsters ugly, mindless killing monsters.

[MattSullivan]

Thing is, even among PACK members there's disagreement over what constitutes "cool looking" It'll take the "Star Wars" of lycanthrope films to fix this. Something even non-werewolf fans can watch and say, "Damn, that was a cool movie"

[Moonstalker]

true

there should be more movies where the werewolves should look cool

but i think they aren't because werewolves in movies are never portrayed as the good guys or the heroes. Then they show them as monsters ugly, mindless killing monsters.

I understand this point: werewolves were originally monsters. Churh murdered countless people believing that they worked for satan and I guess this kinda stuck. In modern days when people use their head insted of believing everything they hear, weres have become more like a symbol and a reference for power and freedom.
This evil werewolf thing is kinda closing to be drained out, for a change we might have our beautiful version of it. Perhaps this point of wiew will become popular some day

[Verborgen Tierinmir]

I always find it funny how the legends and ideas evolve as people bring their different taked on it. I remember learning that L'oup Garu or (something to that spelling) was a true representation of werewolf lore. These lycans suffered a curse brought about by a pact between a man and the devil which was passed down a family through each males. And even thought the ww image has changed dramatically, especially after hollywood, it is still an image of horror or a representations of beasts.

The whole point of that paragraph was really for me to express how it seems that the pack will truly be a driving force for the way people think about lycans. I bet if werewolf could say anything it would be that its awesome to have fans like you guys since living with a curse is bad enough let alone being portrayed as something hideous.

[RedEye]

IMHO: In the old WW movies, and in most of the new ones, the Werewolf represents the OTHER. The different one. The alien. The "not like we are" person.

The Werewolf is the immigrant, who takes away the jobs we wouldn't do anyhow. The Werewolf is the foreigner.

So, since at heart we are still a tribal people, the Werewolf is the non-tribe person; who is ugly, destructive, who is dangerous ( for some reason or other) and who has to be driven out or killed.

That, in my opinion, is what the Werewolf really is...
And yes, we need a "Freeborn" or something like it, to challenge our responses to the non-tribe being. Freeborn is a lot more than just entertainment, it's medicine.

[Berserker]

And yes, we need a "Freeborn" or something like it, to challenge our responses to the non-tribe being. Freeborn is a lot more than just entertainment, it's medicine.

Ehh there have been movies and stories that tackle this issue for a long, long time... like the excellent The Iron Giant , Hellboy, and Monsters Inc., and even E.T. to some extent.

Now something specific to werewolves, on the other hand, is what Freeborn can provide.

[Dreamer]

Agreed Bezerker.

But what we also should avoid is making them a race of Mary Sues. Like Twilight vampires. Oh dear god, Twilight Vampires.

[Leonca~]

I need to see The Howling again. I saw it about 2 years ago or something like that, and all I remember is the kids at the end saying “Oh look, the news lady is turning into a werewolf.” Which I found hilarious.

Bad Moon is still one of my favorites. I’ve actually seen it more than almost any other werewolf movie. The costume isn’t so bad, but the transformation scene is just a terrible example of CGI. Ahh, cheesy goodness.

One of the things that makes me groan in movies or TV shows is when they take a minimalist approach. Maybe they have decent effects elsewhere, but when it comes time for the person to transform they get glowing red eyes and grow sharp teeth and claws and start growling. Lame.

[Vagrant]

[Bloodyredbaron]

[Wingman]

To be perfectly frank, there is no wrong way to create a species of creatures in your own work of fiction, just ways you personally may like or dislike. I’ll tell you what I don’t like, when the curse is portrayed as tied to the progenitor.

Well, that type certain has it's places, such as if the progenitor is a spellcaster of kind and the spell dies with him. But yeah, it's kind of hard to figure out how they're all somehow mystically connected to some guy. It's a little like saying I'll die if my parents do, makes no sense when you look at it logically.

[Lycanthrope]

I don't think that applying "logics" to Werewolves is the right approach. Not if we're trying to tell a story. If we're working within the scope of myths, we're actually forced to assume mystical thinking. From a non-mystical point of view, the existence of Werewolves and removing the affliction by killing the Sire make as much sense - none. Otherwise, however, we're dealing with symbols that can either be easy to relate to or not. Probably most people on the Message Boards feel affinity towards Werewolves for one reason or another. Most likely because they symbolise something they find compelling. Many, however, dislike the idea of removing the affliction by killing the Sire, because they don't find it convincing. Note that I didn't say "true" or "logical". What I mean is that it's an additional symbol that doesn't have the necessary appeal. For instance, if I understood it well, BloodyRedBaron said that removing the curse doesn't lead to any self discovery and battling one's inner demons, while it would "feel right". Other example - the possible concept of freedom is mixed with dependence on someone else - an unacceptable combination for someone who sees Lycanthropy as a mirror for freedom.

Obviously, a single symbol can be compelling for one person and repelling for another. I believe that very few symbols are inherently bad. They can be more or less likely to be used properly, but they could be, nevertheless.

[Kaebora]

Still, you young whipper-snappers have no idea how important some of these works are. Kids these days, calling the original Star Wars slow-paced, with cheesy effects...

Indeed. A friend told me that the original Battlestar Galactica was crap. In fact, the acting wasn't half bad, and it was one of the best Sci-Fi TV shows of its time. Without BG, there wouldn't have been a Star Wars, or a Star Trek.

The same can be said of the original Wolf Man. The effects showing the transformation were good back when it was made. Lets face it, the Wolf Man TF was still more impressive than the one in Blood and Chocolate (rainbowy effects or camera cuts hiding all the shifting).

[Bloodyredbaron]

I don't think that applying "logics" to Werewolves is the right approach. Not if we're trying to tell a story. If we're working within the scope of myths, we're actually forced to assume mystical thinking. From a non-mystical point of view, the existence of Werewolves and removing the affliction by killing the Sire make as much sense - none. Otherwise, however, we're dealing with symbols that can either be easy to relate to or not. Probably most people on the Message Boards feel affinity towards Werewolves for one reason or another. Most likely because they symbolise something they find compelling. Many, however, dislike the idea of removing the affliction by killing the Sire, because they don't find it convincing. Note that I didn't say "true" or "logical". What I mean is that it's an additional symbol that doesn't have the necessary appeal. For instance, if I understood it well, BloodyRedBaron said that removing the curse doesn't lead to any self discovery and battling one's inner demons, while it would "feel right". Other example - the possible concept of freedom is mixed with dependence on someone else - an unacceptable combination for someone who sees Lycanthropy as a mirror for freedom.

You hit the nail on the head, dude. The curse being tied to the source basically means that if the werewolf who bits you fell off a cliff or got hit by a truck, then you’re free of the curse and there’s really no conflict. On the opposite end of the spectrum if you’re using your lycanthropy to save the world and you’re fighting the evil Vampire overlord to prevent him from plunging the world into darkness in South America and your sire slips on a sheet of ice and cracks open his skull in Maine, you’re screwed.

Making curing lycanthropy or vampirism (which is really where this whole thing started) as easy as shoving your sire in front of a train is a cop out.

[shiftergirl]

ok, i know i haven't been on for a while, but decided it was time to come back.
so here is my opinion.

All movies made now are the bad ones, im 16 and remember many of the awsome kind of movies. i still watch movies like Jaws, star wars, Aliens and so forth. Those are the good movies. The moives today suck, they are all made with computers, no effects from hand made work, and i mean sweeting hand made work.

If you all remember, WW were never really bad, just the people that made them wanted them to be, so they could blaim things like murders and so forth on somthing other then human standards. Vampires were created the same way, WW's are not bad, just mistaken and changed to be that way. We humans or rather humans themselves made WW's bad for there own reasons.

Just my opinion now...