What to do with a human who knows too much?

[Sevena]

I have to say that, that was perfectly said Berserker.Well at least i think so.Its something I was trying to get across in an earlier post(the wolf see things differently),when i argued that your human more rational side's decision might not take precedence over the wolf's decision.

[Terastas]

You're half-right Berserker. Wolves are dangerous predators, but they are hunters, not killers. They kill when they are hungry -- when they must, not just because of some deep-seated instinct to do so.

Wolves don't have moral codes as intricate as the ones we live by, but they couldn't operate as a pack if they didn't have at least some rules to live by. Cooperate with the family, protect the cubs, share the wealth, and don't call up what you can't put down. That's about it for wolves. They are not symbols of virtue by any means, but they are not the savage beasts some people want to believe they are either.

The same is true of human beings. All people live by a moral code. More accurately, it's a question of whether they select a code they feel they should aspire to, or if they choose one that best fits their personal interests (like "an eye for an eye" or "might makes right"). Humans can become desensitized to violence or be conditioned to embrace it, but they are not born with an instinct to kill just because they can.

So if wolves are not bloodthirsty killers by default, and human beings are not bloodthirsty killers by default. . . How do werewolves become bloodthirsty killers by default?

I wrote in the thread about the possibility of permanent shifts how I thought a werewolf would really treasure his sense of humanity, which I think could be yet another reason why werewolves would choose to play headgames with their adversaries instead of killing them. Evolution usually calls for the size of the brain to be lessened so the animal needs less food and uses less energy, but humans evolved in reverse: their brains got larger over time and they used that additional brainpower (along with their thumbs) to figure out how to gather more food.

In other words, being able to get inside another person's head and screw with them is something only a human can do.

[Noir-Okami]

Mess with his head.

That would be hilarious. "Yeah, I had this really crazy dream that I saw some guy turn into a wolf last night..." And (of course) he's talking to the werewolf in question.

[Grey]

Well, in our animal like form were might have the same instincts as other animals in matters of character.

[RedEye]

Mess with his head.

That would be hilarious. "Yeah, I had this really crazy dream that I saw some guy turn into a wolf last night..." And (of course) he's talking to the werewolf in question.

You could further mess with their heads by saying, "I had a crazy dream like that too, only it was a girl who turned into a fox!"
The more confusion, the better!

[Renorei]

I voted to "bite him". That way even if he's still bitter and turns you in anyway, he's taking himself down too.

If I were really a werewolf and someone caught me, I'd restrain that person and make them talk to me, and get a feel for what kind of person he/she is, to know how I should react.

[RedEye]

My experieince of six decades has shown me that usually the first "instinctive" reaction to something usually leaves a lot lf mess in its wake.
While biting would do all that Renorei says; it could easily result in a potentially psychotic Werewolf who could do the "Hollywood thing" and get humans actively looking for lupus-amplified humans among themselves.
This could result in a "witch hunt" and bring way too much interest into an area with Werewolves living in it for everyone's safety.
Make it difficult, make the human seem a bit crazy and watch what said human does. This person might make a useful addition to the local Pack; if not, the human is already thought a little "round the bend" and effectively reduced in threat capacity, since now his/her own species is doubting what this person says. A little more work, and they are certifiable. Problem solved.

[CaptainWolfe]

Well I was going to post something insightful here, however RedEye beat me to it.

I voted for messing with their head, but I feel that might not even be necessary. There are a select few of my friends who would just be merely ok with the situation. They'd just keep it between me and them. However, a pack leader might not be ok with that situation.

Generally speaking I feel that it would all depend on what type of person it was.

[AngryGothChick]

Knowing me, I'd probably stalk them until they keep quiet. My friend would probably bite them or kill them.

[Lycaon]

Wrong or not, I would kill him. There is no way I would ever compromise my pack.
Family first.

[Aki]

Wrong or not, I would kill him. There is no way I would ever compromise my pack.
Family first.

People can dismiss a man who claims to see a werewolf as crazy. They can even dismiss pictures in our digital age of Photoshop.

But when that man turns up dead, it's going to start a hell of a witch hunt. Probably for "wild animals" like normal wolves, of course, but it's not going to be brushed off. Violent death is not something humanity ignores.

It goes and 'corrects' that behavior with extra prejudice.

Killing would not only be morally wrong, but it would amp up pressure from normal humans as well as attract the hell out of any hunters who got wind of it.

[JoshuaMadoc]

Wrong or not, I would kill him. There is no way I would ever compromise my pack.
Family first.

Jeopardizing your family/pack's safety is hardly "family first".

[Terastas]

Wrong or not, I would kill him. There is no way I would ever compromise my pack.
Family first.

People can dismiss a man who claims to see a werewolf as crazy. They can even dismiss pictures in our digital age of Photoshop.

But when that man turns up dead, it's going to start a hell of a witch hunt. Probably for "wild animals" like normal wolves, of course, but it's not going to be brushed off. Violent death is not something humanity ignores.

It goes and 'corrects' that behavior with extra prejudice.

Killing would not only be morally wrong, but it would amp up pressure from normal humans as well as attract the hell out of any hunters who got wind of it.

Beat me to it. We deal with kooks and crazies on a daily basis and don't give what they are saying much thought at all. . . Unless they suddenly turn up dead or disappear. People would eventually start to wonder and ask themselves: "Why would somebody want him silenced if what he was saying wasn't true?"

Eventually the crazy people will either do one of two things: Give up, or pull a Richard Heene by doing something unforgivably stupid to try and get people to listen to him. Either way, the problem goes away by itself.

The only time it would really be excusable to stalk / harass / screw with him would be if he was trying to get more information. And the only time it would be acceptable to kill him would be if he had information that had not already been revealed. It might be worth the pack's while, for example, to endure some extra suspicion into the existence of werewolves if it would mean preventing any of their member or assets from being mentioned by name.

[Moonraiser]

AB got me thinking...Biting someone to just keep the fact that there are werewolves a secret is really, REALLY risky. I never realized how risky. There is always a chance that the person you bit will be bitter. But then again, if they are bitten and they feel like they need to try and "Turn us in" by showing their Gift, something bad will most likely happen to them, and anyone in that situation could figure out that it is really dangerous to do so. So I do believe that if someone saw you, and you had to go about biting them that they would most likely try and keep it under wraps or..."Under fur" But they won't tell anyone especially when they realize a short while later that that sensation starting to act up in their body...isn't just a normal sensation... *Winks*

But that is assuming of course, that you bit the person and they somehow got away. It only takes one person to ruin it for us all, and there is a right way and a wrong way to deal with a peeping Tom. Biting them and letting them get away is the WRONG way. Biting someone is one thing, but going about how to do it is another. The best possible thing to do that I believe would be most effective is catch the person who saw you and knock them out if you have to. Take them somewhere and tie them up so they don't try and run off if they wake up, assuming you knocked them out. And for the love of all that is good, don't wait for them to wake up and see a massive furry drooling werewolf standing in front of them. Shift to your human form and wait for them to wake up. (And for Christs sake, put some bloody clothes on. Well...preferably NOT bloody, but that was just a saying. You know what I mean!)

When they wake up (Assuming you knocked them out) and see a clothed you standing there in front of them, wait for them to calm down. Tell them you aren't going to hurt them. Make them believe that you have good intentions, but also let them know that they must have good intentions too or everything can go downhill for them. Be firm, but not too firm. Don't be scary, don't be mean. Let them know what position that they are in. Be extremely blunt. Tell them the truth. Tell them what you are, that there are more. Tell them that it isn't a curse but a gift. Tell them that anything they have seen in the movies portraying werewolves as evil bloodthirsty monsters is wrong. If they don't believe any of it, convince them otherwise. Show them proof. In all, you are probably going to have to sit with this person for awhile to get what needs to be said in their heads. Once you are convinced that they understand what you have told them you can let release them of their bonds.

The last thing you will probably need to do is let them know their options. Let them know that running across and actually seeing a werewolf comes with a price. Tell them it can be either a good price or a bad one. You let them decide for themselves, and considering what you told them about werewolves earlier, they should want to pick the good option. If they do, you tell them what needs to happen, and that they need to be bitten.

DO NOT GO INTO EXPLANATION OF WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN, OR THE PAIN INVOLVED.

If you do that, it will make the person afraid and scared. They may try and back out of the deal, or worst case scenario, run. If they run you will have to chase them. That will make them even more frightened, and if they are frightened, they will most likely not listen to reason any more. Once you caught up to them, they may refuse to listen, and in the end you may have to end up killing them. You can't just let them go...you can't keep them... When a human wanders in and sees a werewolf they have very little options. They can either comply and become a werewolf themselves, or be killed. It's a harsh system, but it is a must. If you do it correctly, killing will not be necessary. You should only kill as a last resort. When all else fails. Reason with them to the best of your abilities. LET THEM KNOW THAT BEING A WEREWOLF IS BETTER THAN DEATH.

It is essential that you try the best you can to let the person see reason. Don't just kill them because they say no. If you do that, then what better are we than the monsters in the movies?

[ledrif]

Oh well I think first of all I would jsut keep staring at the human and wait him to do something depending on what he is going to do I decide what's best!
Who knows maybe it could be somone who want to be a werewolf too....
I think there's no problem in giving the gift to him if he knows he can't tell anyone about it and the rest of the stuff and most important say to him to join mine pack...
And then again by saying Human you mean anyone and by anyone you mean that it could be a friend and if it was an human friend I wouldn't have the courage to kill him after all he's a friend!
In the friend case I think I would have just say "hi there don't worry I won't bite you at least if you don't want too" and strike out an funny face assuming that he saw that I am he's friend...
And again by human it could be you Human mother assuming that you where bitten and she decides to track you in one of your night out "Camping" then what you have done with her Killed her She's your family too she gave you birth without her you wouldn't be there...
By putting Only human in there you bring up thousands of situations that you wouldn't have just jumped out on the "human" and tried to kill him...
Then I think that it clearly depends on the human and where he saw you and alot of factors but on all the cases I think I would just try Biting him or even play with he's mind like "OH I am an werewolf and you a pink zebra and we are on macdonaldsss" then just knock him out to seem it was only a dream!

[Terastas]

AB got me thinking...Biting someone to just keep the fact that there are werewolves a secret is really, REALLY risky. I never realized how risky. There is always a chance that the person you bit will be bitter. But then again, if they are bitten and they feel like they need to try and "Turn us in" by showing their Gift, something bad will most likely happen to them, and anyone in that situation could figure out that it is really dangerous to do so. So I do believe that if someone saw you, and you had to go about biting them that they would most likely try and keep it under wraps or..."Under fur" But they won't tell anyone especially when they realize a short while later that that sensation starting to act up in their body...isn't just a normal sensation... *Winks*

There was another thread not too long ago where I likened having lycanthropy to always carrying a concealed firearm that was fully loaded and had no safety on it. Results may vary, but no matter how you slice it, lycanthropy is power. And when you think of it that way, giving lycanthropy to the people that know you have it makes just about as much sense as giving away free firearms to everyone that sees you concealing.

The screening process with the werewolves in Night Life almost always involves a familiar leading the introductions. They really try not to spell it out for them (because they know that if they did, the newcomer would doubt them), but they do try to push them in that direction (Paul, the main char in Night Life, has four people come to meet him, and the werewolf assigned to watching him challenges him to try and guess which of them are the actual werewolves). No matter how you define lycanthropy, the option to join the pack should also look more appealing if you have the additional option to refrain from actually becoming a werewolf.

Unwilling infections are rare, typically only accidental, and when they do happen, priority #1 is always to locate the individual and have them under their control before the next full moon. Accidental infections typically only ever occur to two types of people: human familiars that are already in the custody of the pack, or high risk individuals that the pack has already been authorized to kill, so it's rare for them to ever have to give the initiation speech to someone that already has it (the aforementioned protagonist being one those rare exceptions).

In Night Life, there's a transition period where the lycanthropic syndrome more or less makes itself at home in the new host body and conditions it to become a shifter -- this is an agonizing, possibly fatal process, so for those rare exceptions, the pack is capable of offering a compromise of sorts, IE: "If you can keep your head down and your mouth shut, we can show you how to live with this." Even if the individual in question agrees, they don't take his word for it; willing and unwilling newcomers alike always have a roommate/neighbor werewolf that will (ideally) be willing to put them down if given any indication that they may be abusing the privilege.

Best way to keep something secret is to be picky about who you share it with. If you had written a screenplay that you didn't want anyone to know about and someone found out, you wouldn't say to them: "Don't tell anyone that I wrote this. Here, let me give you a copy." That's kind of like what giving lycanthropy to someone that hasn't already proven they can keep a secret would be like.

[Volkodlak]

i would ignore him if he didnt took picture of me or film me if he did i would youst try too destroy camera or gsm without harming him

[silver1]

You could eat them but I would just turn them so if they did tell,they would be putting themselves in danger as well. I would also do everything I could to help them through the first change and cope with being a werewolf.

[Volkodlak]

you can ignore them anyway who will belive them

[Meeper]

I'm tired right now, and I'm having trouble absorbing the other posts, so I'll just give it straight and deal with any weirdness after. I don't know exactly how I'd deal with someone who found out I was a werewolf, so much depends on circumstances, so I'll pick apart the poll options the way I see it.

1: Kill him.
Now, I'm going to give the cleaned up, expletive free version of my opinion to this solution. One of the reason for keeping your werewolf identity secret is the very real perception that a werewolf is a threat, people don't like threats, they tend to do something about it, like try to kill it before it kills them. So, to protect yourself from the threat of being perceived as a threat, you go right ahead and actually present a real threat by killing the threat to you, because you're not a threat really after all. This is a self perpetuating loop of violence, and makes you a bit of a ironical plonker.

2: Bite him so that if he tells anyone he will be putting himself in danger too.
This would really, really annoy me, you would not believe how much, and by the way, I'd be a werewolf like you if you did that, level pegging when I come back to kick your behind. I'd probably put myself in harm's way just to see a plonker like you taken out for inflicting yourself on me, it'd be worth it to put myself at risk to see you go down.

3: Try to convince/bribe him not to say anything.
Not sure about this one, but I'll tell you what, it's first class evidence you're a wacko, or a werewolf, nothing quite like making sure they know exactly what you are! In either case, you better have a good story to tell.

4: Threaten/stalk him to scare him into keeping quiet.
Grow up. That is all.

5: Mess with his head so that he thinks he was just hallucinating/dreaming etc.
See option 4.

6: Report the incident to your pack leaders and let them decide what to do.
That's getting more sensible, so long as the pack leaders don't fall into category 1-5

7: Do nothing and hope that he will assume no one would believe him.
You'd be surprised how uninterested people are in concerning themselves with something that didn't try to kill them, bite them, mess with their mind, or otherwise be a waste of their time.

8: Other.
Make friends with them maybe?

The Meeper.

[Uniform Two Six]

Meeper...
That entire post should become dialogue in Freeborn. You rock.

"You want to turn her so she won't talk? You're an idiot -- and here's why..."

[Volkodlak]

Meeper...
That entire post should become dialogue in Freeborn. You rock.

"You want to turn her so she won't talk? You're an idiot -- and here's why..."

I agree,but woudnt be able to kill someone

[silver1]

I agree with you Lovec, I wouldn't be able to kill someone without it bothering me.

[Volkodlak]

its worse at me i woudnt be able too do it even if my life is in danger

[Meeper]

Meeper...
That entire post should become dialogue in Freeborn. You rock.

"You want to turn her so she won't talk? You're an idiot -- and here's why..."

Well, I'm hearing rumblings that Freeborn will become a series, so who knows, there may be a bunch of us getting quoted all over the place in the coming months .

The Meeper.