Okies..Check out this werewolf expert..*rolls eyes* >_>

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Post by ravaged_warrior »

Shadow Wulf wrote:Oh you mean dobermen, calling you ignorant! Is that it? :o

Well I agree with you there joker. But you shouldnt listen to him (or her)

Doberman, you havent even been here that long and you so please dont call names to a veteran pack member. It doesnt look well.
I should stay out of this, but...

Doberman didn't really call her ignorant, just her reaction towards your post. Still, not really the way he should have worded it, especially a word that could, hell, likely WOULD, be taken as a personal attack. Not sure what this situation has to do with your art, though, Joker, I don't see why you'd punish everyone for it.
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Post by Anook »

Wait a minute.

Shadow Wulf, are you saying new members have to respect the older members just because they've been here longer?
No offense, but that just seems really stupid to me. I mean, we should respect one another wether they are old or new, not because they've been here longer.
And there has been name calling going on on this board ever since I joined!
How is this situation any different?
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Post by MoonKit »

Back On Topic:

I say we all leave notes on his site asking where the tails are. :lol: Maybe he'll eventually break down and see how cool tails really are. :D
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Post by Fenrir »

Doberman wrote:
Teh_DarkJokerWolf wrote:
Shadow Wulf wrote: Sabre, you seem to act like you know all about werewolves and that your an expert yourself. As far as I can tell only fanbase drawings of werewolves have tails. I love werewolves, tails or no tails, as long as the whole body looks good. He does make good a point and I agree with Vuldari. Why are the werewolf and furry fans that love tails make such a big deal about it when the ones that doesnt like tails dont? I noticed this quite a bit, its almost as if the tail lovers are indirectly trying to ban all werewolf drawings without tails. Relax, he likes hes werewolves without tails...then let him be. Like Vuldari said, dont blame him for believing in traditional legends, it doesnt make you (or Z...) right for forcing your beliefs on him, thats what he believes, learn to accept it.

Who knows? Theres probably werewolf fans out there that hate tails are offended by people like us who say they should because its (scientifcly)more plausible, or so we believe.
You know what..I DON'T ACT..I happen to know facts about werewolves Shadow Wulf..But I rather keep them to myself, Hence I hardly ever post in What should a werewolf be section..I know alot more than you could ever possibly know, that's the only reason I posted this here..I have good reason to keep what I know to myself Shadow Wulf..This topic was posted for others to see an Of course I KNEW somebody would try to throw it back in my face..I can only laugh at that..ha..ha..This thread can go where it wants. I said my piece..
What stuff about werewolves do you know that we don't? I agree with Amoux, if you have any info that you think we can't easily find, then please tell us.
But Joker, you make it sound like werewolves are real( Well, the physical shape shifting ones).
Telling Shadow Wulf that you know a whole lot more is completely ignorant; when you don't know what(or how much) he knows about werewolves in the first place!
I do not believe she was calling Shadow Wulf ignorant. I believe she was calling this fool of an artist who did not respect her oppinion that werewolves have tails....infact not only did he not respect it he tossed it aside as if it were rubish. It's like me tossing you beliefs in whatever god you have aside and claiming that you've been wrong and give you odd semi-oppinionated proof. Does no one have respect for anyones oppinions anymore? Sure, I am a transindentalist and don't let other people's oppinions effect me, but that doesn't mean I have to shatter there oppinions on my way.

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Post by Doberman »

I never specifically called Joker ignorant just her reaction.

Yes, ravageed_ warrior, you are right. Instead of saying her reaction was ignorant, I should have just flatly stated it was wrong and out of line.
Well, at least thats what I think. I didn't CALL HER ignorant at all. :P
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Post by DarkShadow »

Doberman wrote:I never specifically called Joker ignorant just her reaction.

Yes, ravageed_ warrior, you are right. Instead of saying her reaction was ignorant, I should have just flatly stated it was wrong and out of line.
Well, at least thats what I think. I didn't CALL HER ignorant at all. :P
I was thinking I should stay out of this, but when someone makes another member feel un-welcome, THAT is a problem for me.
Well I agree with Fenrir. I though that you were calling her ignorant, even though you didn't use those words. There is no need for this kind of crap on here. What makes you think this thread is out of line?
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Post by Amoux »

Anook wrote:Wait a minute.

Shadow Wulf, are you saying new members have to respect the older members just because they've been here longer?
No offense, but that just seems really stupid to me. I mean, we should respect one another wether they are old or new, not because they've been here longer.
And there has been name calling going on on this board ever since I joined!
How is this situation any different?

I agree with you. I also believe we should all respect one another, whether it be new or old members.
I don't think respect should be given to those who have been here the longest, but to everyone.
And I agree with ravaged_warrior and Anook, Doberman was not calling her ignorant. He or she was simply stating that it was stupid for Joker to think she knew more about werewolves then Shadow Wulf when in fact, Joker doesn't know how much he knows.
Well, at least thats the impression I got from his/her response.
Last edited by Amoux on Wed May 09, 2007 10:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by PariahPoet »

Doberman wrote:I never specifically called Joker ignorant just her reaction.

Yes, ravageed_ warrior, you are right. Instead of saying her reaction was ignorant, I should have just flatly stated it was wrong and out of line.
Well, at least thats what I think. I didn't CALL HER ignorant at all. :P
You have absolutely no authority to tell another member he/she is out of line.


Joker- try not to let people get to you. You know how things have gotten around here. :(
No one is even civil anymore, and they have no idea what's going on.
We can't expect people to understand when they're in the dark.
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Post by Doberman »

Why can't I tell someone they are out of line but they can tell me?
Please help me understand. Is it because I'm new?
And how am I not being civil?
And if you want me understand than please help to so I won't be left in the dark.
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Post by DarkShadow »

Doberman wrote:Why can't I tell someone they are out of line but they can tell me?
Please help me understand. Is it because I'm new?
And how am I not being civil?
And if you want me understand than please help to so I won't be left in the dark.
We aren't saying you're out of line and we have no problem accepting new people. Just be careful about what you say and keep it to yourself if it's not nice. Why is nobody civil anymore? :(
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Post by vrikasatma »

I have to admit, since werewolf anatomy is very subjective (vis-a-vis, no RL reference to check against), it's anyone's guess.

If the author wants to think werewolves don't have tails... [shrug]...okay, that's his call. We like to think werewolves *do* have tails...[shrug]...okay, that's how our maritime craft stays above the water's surface. Neither position invalidates the other.

There's definitely better things to get one's knickers in a twist over. You want werewolves with tails, go ahead and draw them that way! I'll continue to do so whether someone else publishes a book on werewolf art or not.

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Post by Amoux »

DarkShadow wrote:
Doberman wrote:Why can't I tell someone they are out of line but they can tell me?
Please help me understand. Is it because I'm new?
And how am I not being civil?
And if you want me understand than please help to so I won't be left in the dark.
We aren't saying you're out of line and we have no problem accepting new people. Just be careful about what you say and keep it to yourself if it's not nice. Why is nobody civil anymore? :(
Your saying Doberman needs to keep “mean” things to himself/ herself but, what about the Ireland Declares War on France Thread? Most of the people who posted there said they hated the French, that we are mere cravens who would run away from any battle. People on this board also stated that we smell! I am French.
Now how do you think that made me feel?
Did I say anything?
No.
Anook was so kind to defend me when he/she didn't even know me! She/he was the only one!

To top it all off, most if not all of their accusations were wrong! We French are not rude or smelly.
I have helped countless AMERICANS navigate their way around the streets of Paris many times and I have also made many American friends who I still keep in touch with to this day!
And we do take showers EVERDAY! Most of us are actually quite clean.

So, really, no one is in any position to say that Doberman was out of line or mean.

Please, look at the speck in your own eye before you notice somebody else's.
Last edited by Amoux on Wed May 09, 2007 11:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by DarkShadow »

Amoux wrote:
DarkShadow wrote:
Doberman wrote:Why can't I tell someone they are out of line but they can tell me?
Please help me understand. Is it because I'm new?
And how am I not being civil?
And if you want me understand than please help to so I won't be left in the dark.
We aren't saying you're out of line and we have no problem accepting new people. Just be careful about what you say and keep it to yourself if it's not nice. Why is nobody civil anymore? :(
Your saying Doberman needs to keep “mean” things to himself/ herself but, what about the Ireland Declares War on France Thread? Most of the people who posted there said they hated the French, that we are mere cravens who would run away from any battle. People on this board also stated that we smell! I am French.
Now how do you think that made me feel?
Did I say anything?
No.
Anook was so kind to stick up for me when he/she didn't even know me! She/he was the only one!

To top it all off, most if not all of their accusations were wrong! We French are not rude or smelly.
I have helped countless AMERICANS navigate their way around the streets of Paris many times and I have also made many American friends who I still keep in touch with to this day!
And we do take showers EVERDAY! Most of us are actually quite clean.

So, really, no one is in any position to tell say that Doberman was out of line or mean.
That is pretty bad. I never saw that thread, but I bet you were insulted. I am not saying just they are mean. I am saying in general how things have gone down in society.
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Post by Amoux »

Its in the Non-Were Related Section.
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Post by PariahPoet »

Amoux wrote:
DarkShadow wrote:
Doberman wrote:Why can't I tell someone they are out of line but they can tell me?
Please help me understand. Is it because I'm new?
And how am I not being civil?
And if you want me understand than please help to so I won't be left in the dark.
We aren't saying you're out of line and we have no problem accepting new people. Just be careful about what you say and keep it to yourself if it's not nice. Why is nobody civil anymore? :(
Your saying Doberman needs to keep “mean” things to himself/ herself but, what about the Ireland Declares War on France Thread? Most of the people who posted there said they hated the French, that we are mere cravens who would run away from any battle. People on this board also stated that we smell! I am French.
Now how do you think that made me feel?
Did I say anything?
No.
Anook was so kind to defend me when he/she didn't even know me! She/he was the only one!

To top it all off, most if not all of their accusations were wrong! We French are not rude or smelly.
I have helped countless AMERICANS navigate their way around the streets of Paris many times and I have also made many American friends who I still keep in touch with to this day!
And we do take showers EVERDAY! Most of us are actually quite clean.

So, really, no one is in any position to say that Doberman was out of line or mean.

Please, look at the speck in your own eye before you notice somebody else's.
Excuse me? I happen to recall saying favorable things about France in that topic.
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Post by Amoux »

Oh that is right. I remember now.
Pariah, You and Scott Gardner both defended the French. I apologize, It was hard for me to focus on your(and his) comment when most of them were bad and expressed negative feelings toward the French for stupid reasons.
Last edited by Amoux on Thu May 10, 2007 5:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Midnight »

Shadow Wulf wrote:When you say facts I hope you meant as in just history of werewolves mythology.
And RedEye, could you give me the links to your source.
I don't know what Red Eye's source is but I had a quick nosey at the illustrations in one of my books (Montague Summers' "The Werewolf in Lore and Legend", 2003 edition of a 1933 book) and found the following details in the illustrative plates:
Goya's "The Warlock's Metamorphosis". The reproduction isn't good but the figure in the left foreground has a distinct tail. 19th century artist.
"A Werewolf Attacks a Man". Werewolf as a full wolf and with a definite tail (perhaps more dog-like than wolf-like).
"The Transvection of Witches". Undated woodcut. No werewolf content.
"The Wild Beast of the Gevaudan". Very long and quite solid tail. Beast looks more like a large feline than a wolf. Picture published in 1765, looks a bit like a copperplate engraving (don't think they had lithography back then).
"The Werewolves". Undated illustration from an edition of Baring-Gould's book on the subject. Two werewolves in full wolf form, both have tails although the one in the foreground is hiding most if its tail behind it.
"Les Lupins", Maurice Sand, from a book by George Sand. A group of ten or so bipedal, digitigrade wolves leaning against a wall. Due to the shadows cast it is difficult to tell whether or not they have tails, but two definitely seem to and the remainder may have.
"Le Meneu de Loups", ibid. A group of wolves in full wolf form accompanying a bagpiper. Amazingly the bagpiper is still alive.
Woodcut from "The damnable life and death of on Stubbe Peeter", 1590. The first of the eight panels shows a bipedal wolf with no tail, walking plantigrade, and a full wolf, with tail, savaging a bystander. The remaining panels all show either full wolves and hounds (with tails) or full humans (mainly villagers going all Mengele on Stubbe Peeter).

As a quick aside... I haven't read the book thoroughly, but have skimmed it and read some interesting bits... The author is firmly of the belief that werewolves are tools of the Devil and is very set in his ways about it - I can easily imagine him as being played by Christopher Lee in full-on manic mode, declaiming the text.

(Fun Trivia Fact: Best typo of this post (now fixed): "woofcut". Interesting but Irrelevant Fact: "Transvection" (i.e. the act of flying through the sky, as by a witch on a broomstick) is also the title of a fairly bloody good CD of songs by The Magick Heads).

Amoux - I think it's a (some) American thing. Mainly by people who have forgotten which country it was that supported them against the British in the first place. And it's not only you - it wasn't so long ago that someone tried to tell me that just because I was a Damned Foreigner that I therefore hated all Americans and got off on flying planes into office buildings. I posted something in "Venting" about it a while back.

Doberman - You can disagree with someone without insulting them or being rude to them. There's a world of difference between saying "I don't agree with you. I think..." and "You're wrong!" Go and have a look at the "Werewolves... Pitiful?" topic for example of civilised yet passionate debate. There's some quite heated disagreement there but (at a quick glance) I don't see anyone abusing Vuldari for having an unpopular opinion - and I don't see him being offensive either.
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Post by JoshuaMadoc »

This is starting to remind me of that time one of the Pack members kept calling my werewolves jackals because of how freakin' long the ears i draw are.
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Post by Kirk Hammett »

Sabre, you seem to act like you know all about werewolves and that your an expert yourself.
Personally I'm with Sabre here.

I prefer tails. Yes, everyone can have their own werewolf. As Anubis said, though, MOST mythology involves tails.

Hollywood is pretty sorry. And added full moons to the picture.

While a great horror artist, I've seen far better horror werewolf art. We are all entitled to an opinion. He has no right to press it upon people. His points are not valid because of the difference between many hollywood films and contemporary werewolves, to mythological werewolves. He should have noted that he just preferred no tails, that would have ended any conflict.

Maybe I'm bias because I like bushy long tails.

Sabre has every right to be angry. Not just because of the man's opinions which she (and I) do not agree with, but overall with the lack of tails in movies today and art.

Don't you all get annoyed sometimes when you see a bad werewolf? You do. :D so do I.
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Post by Shadow Wulf »

Anook wrote:Wait a minute.

Shadow Wulf, are you saying new members have to respect the older members just because they've been here longer?
No offense, but that just seems really stupid to me. I mean, we should respect one another wether they are old or new, not because they've been here longer.
And there has been name calling going on on this board ever since I joined!
How is this situation any different?
I just thuoght she called her ignorant, and yes I believe a fresh new pack member should respect veteran pack members unless that veteran is being unreasonable or down right an a** or etc. They can debate and so on, just dont call them names and I thought she was doing that. I think you shouldnt call names, period.
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Post by Kirk Hammett »

Another note:
What stuff about werewolves do you know that we don't? I agree with Amoux, if you have any info that you think we can't easily find, then please tell us.
But Joker, you make it sound like werewolves are real( Well, the physical shape shifting ones).
Telling Shadow Wulf that you know a whole lot more is completely ignorant; when you don't know what(or how much) he knows about werewolves in the first place!
Please re-read what you said. It's uncalled for.

In fact, a lot of things said here are totally uncalled for.

(See? I'm learning to be assertive!)
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Post by Anook »

Shadow Wulf wrote:
Anook wrote:Wait a minute.

Shadow Wulf, are you saying new members have to respect the older members just because they've been here longer?
No offense, but that just seems really stupid to me. I mean, we should respect one another wether they are old or new, not because they've been here longer.
And there has been name calling going on on this board ever since I joined!
How is this situation any different?
I just thuoght she called her ignorant, and yes I believe a fresh new pack member should respect veteran pack members unless that veteran is being unreasonable or down right an a** or etc. They can debate and so on, just dont call them names and I thought she was doing that. I think you shouldnt call names, period.
Well, like I said before I believe we should all respect one another. I'm not going to respect someone just because they've been here longer, and I'm certainly not going to disrespect a member because they are new.
And Dobeman already said he/she wasn't calling Joker Ignorant. Yes, Doberman should have used a different term.
His/her comment wasn't un-called for either. Maybe a little bit extreme but wasn't Joker's post a little extreme as well...just a little. I mean, from her post I actually got the impression that she was saying she knew way more about werewolves then us. I mean, I thought she was telling us we didn't know a thing about werewolves. At least thats the impression I got, however wrong it may be. And I've looked at the Rant thread and I don't think anyone should bash Doberman either. Its obvious he/she got the wrong impression as I did and that doesn't mean he's childish. People get the wrong impression all the time, it happens.
Last edited by Anook on Thu May 10, 2007 4:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Shadow Wulf »

I understand sometimes people get the wrong impression of what others are saying. It happens all the time, especialy me and Vuldari. I dont disrespect Doberman at all, I treat Doberman like any other pack member, I dont treat him/her any different, but like I said I thought she was calling sabre ignorant. But I realized now she wasnt calling Sabre anything and I apoligize for the misunderstanding.
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Post by Kirk Hammett »

Now I'm lost. Sorry if I am lost and something wrong has been said.

I'm lost as usual. :?

This is where I leave the conversation :wink:
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Post by Teh_DarkJokerWolf »

I'm sorry as well..I was really the one attacking folks here..I'm sorry to everyone..This thread got outta control because of my stupid statement..I just don't know what to say anymore..At least not right now..I'm sorry guys..The werewolf subject is just to much that's why I avoid it..
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