To quote the movie "Bad Moon"
"A shotgun in the head would kill it."
A werewolf can be killed like any other creature.
Next topic. What kills a werewolf?
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NightmareHero
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Treads Lightly
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I too think that s the silver is a bit of a farce. I have had this theory that the synthesis for the silver myth was the fact that it was valuable. A werewolf hunter would say, “sure I’ll kill the beast, but first I need something to make a silver weapon with, hey that expensive platter over there would do nicely,” thus scamming their potential customers out of even more money, then simply using conventional weapons to kill the werewolf or just running off with the spoils.
While werewolves are obviously not “normal” animals, I don’t picture them as being invincible. Perhaps a reason for the idea that werewolves are far tougher than their human counterparts is the way in which wolves deal with pain. If a wolf were shot through a non-vital part of its body it would likely keep running. A human would fall down and writhe in pain. It stands to reason that werewolves would have a similar numbness to what would normally be extreme pain.
I can live with some regeneration, but if a were loses an arm, its gone. I feel the same way about being shot through a vital organ such as the heart, or brain.
As one poster said earlier, weapons of lore kinda…well sucked. Wolves have thick skin, so therefore it can be assumed that werewolves have even tougher skin. Weapons such as .22 caliber pistols might not penetrate their pelt at a moderate distance. The same may be true with other short range weapons such as shotguns, small rifles and anything that uses black powder. However, a 7mm would have little trouble penetrating much of anything up to 600 yards or so. This would likely be true of large caliber handguns at short range. A previous poster mentioned M-16s, keep in mind that they are still .22 caliber., just with more oomph behind them and usually a full metal jacket. They penetrate much better, but stink at long ranges.
In my opinion werewolves would have far more to fear from Teflon than silver
While werewolves are obviously not “normal” animals, I don’t picture them as being invincible. Perhaps a reason for the idea that werewolves are far tougher than their human counterparts is the way in which wolves deal with pain. If a wolf were shot through a non-vital part of its body it would likely keep running. A human would fall down and writhe in pain. It stands to reason that werewolves would have a similar numbness to what would normally be extreme pain.
I can live with some regeneration, but if a were loses an arm, its gone. I feel the same way about being shot through a vital organ such as the heart, or brain.
As one poster said earlier, weapons of lore kinda…well sucked. Wolves have thick skin, so therefore it can be assumed that werewolves have even tougher skin. Weapons such as .22 caliber pistols might not penetrate their pelt at a moderate distance. The same may be true with other short range weapons such as shotguns, small rifles and anything that uses black powder. However, a 7mm would have little trouble penetrating much of anything up to 600 yards or so. This would likely be true of large caliber handguns at short range. A previous poster mentioned M-16s, keep in mind that they are still .22 caliber., just with more oomph behind them and usually a full metal jacket. They penetrate much better, but stink at long ranges.
In my opinion werewolves would have far more to fear from Teflon than silver
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Apokryltaros
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Treads Lightly
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Teflon is used to manufacture armor piercing bullets, not rocket launchers. Although a rocket launcher would likely do the job, and then some.Apokryltaros wrote: But, do you know how awkward it would be to carry around a rocketlauncher on a werewolf hunt?
OK, maybe I should clarify my statement there. What I was shooting for was the idea that a werewolf’s skin might be roughly equivalent to body armor. I am not saying that it wouldn’t hurt to get shot, but that small arms fire would have some difficulty in penetrating their pelt. This would give them the appearance of having some sort of super human ability to regenerate, especially when coupled with their natural tolerance to pain.
I don’t like the idea that they are immortal or can regenerate so fast that a shot through the heart wouldn’t even make them flinch.
The way I see it, yes, they CAN regenerate (not uber-fast though... just a lot quicker healing rate than humans.) and as for the silver?
It's a myth. Any mortal wound can kill, but werewolves themselves propagated the 'only silver can kill' myth to give themselves a better chance at survival, since it not exactly cheap and easy to make weapons out of pure silver.
It's a myth. Any mortal wound can kill, but werewolves themselves propagated the 'only silver can kill' myth to give themselves a better chance at survival, since it not exactly cheap and easy to make weapons out of pure silver.
My Werewolf Code!:
WWC1.0 SSHb LNAn SPDbsh SILt WTRn GDRs UNQd EATafvy SGNepcy SPKw STCb WLL+ HRT++ DLY+++++ STY+++++ INT0 RGN+ JMP+ STR+ BIG+ COL++ AGE+ CMN- AGL+ IRT+ EYE+ FUR+
WWC1.0 SSHb LNAn SPDbsh SILt WTRn GDRs UNQd EATafvy SGNepcy SPKw STCb WLL+ HRT++ DLY+++++ STY+++++ INT0 RGN+ JMP+ STR+ BIG+ COL++ AGE+ CMN- AGL+ IRT+ EYE+ FUR+
killing a werewolf
1) Drowning... for obvious reasons.
2) Fire... Third and fourth degree burns cause massive damage and loss of tissue. But, if the damage is not enough to kill outrigh then I see regeneration working... maybe with sever scaring. (May not stop the regeneration but that would show limits to this ability)
3) Acid... Strong acids...see fire above. Much the same effect
4) Silver... I do not see normal bullets disolving in a werewolf due to the regeneration thing, more likely pushed out of the body by the rapid healing from inside out. Or likley bullets if fragmented may just remain in a werewwolf indefinitely (as in people unless removed surgically ) Silver on the other hand has traditionally been assiciated w/werewolves, again the silver/moon connections in mythology. I see silver acting as a allergin causing severe reactions (instant anaphylactic shock). Even severe damage from normal weapons/bullets could be healed if not caused by silver. Even severe brain damage. But, the werewolf when healed surely would not be the same. Amnesia, stroke affects or the werewolf could heal fully but, be reduced to the state of a simpleton who over time could possibly relearn skills, etc. But in this case I see that werewolf having a completely different personality as everything it was, experiences education, etc prior to the damage was lost.
5) Massive damage (ie a safe, care, dumptruck, etc dropped on a werewolf. or being hit by a car at a high rate of speed, falling from a tall building ) Depending on the damage sustained, many of these injuries may kill a person but would could conceivable be healable depending on how much damage was done. I like the idea of loose your head for any reason and a werewolf is done. Or, cause enough trauma to the brain and again done. This catagory would also include being impaled on something. If you can't get yourself off of the big piece of rebar sticking through your body and eventually the regeneration thing will no longer help. Also depending on what part of the body is stuck you may or may not live or live longer. With the ability to quickly close wounds around an arrow, spear, peice of rebar etc sticking out/through you, you could be up and about but, of course be in a gereat deal of pain at the same time.
6) lightining/electricity.... In high enough amperage, electeicution works much the same as fire...only from the inside out. Electricity/lightning for example is very hot. that is why metals melt (if not properly grounded) stone shatters, wood catches fire etc. Again, it would depend on the amperage and duration of the exposure to determine if a werewolf would be done.
7) Severe cold... A werewolf would most probably be able to resist cold far better than a person. But, unless its cells have built in antifreeze like many bugs or frogs, when it thawed out the cellular damage would be beyond repair. ( the ice crystals that form in things like you and me while freeezing, pierce the cell walls of every cell in your body as they form. so when you thaw out everything is damaged. This is the dilemma that cryogenics has not solved ...yet. )
my $.02 worth
2) Fire... Third and fourth degree burns cause massive damage and loss of tissue. But, if the damage is not enough to kill outrigh then I see regeneration working... maybe with sever scaring. (May not stop the regeneration but that would show limits to this ability)
3) Acid... Strong acids...see fire above. Much the same effect
4) Silver... I do not see normal bullets disolving in a werewolf due to the regeneration thing, more likely pushed out of the body by the rapid healing from inside out. Or likley bullets if fragmented may just remain in a werewwolf indefinitely (as in people unless removed surgically ) Silver on the other hand has traditionally been assiciated w/werewolves, again the silver/moon connections in mythology. I see silver acting as a allergin causing severe reactions (instant anaphylactic shock). Even severe damage from normal weapons/bullets could be healed if not caused by silver. Even severe brain damage. But, the werewolf when healed surely would not be the same. Amnesia, stroke affects or the werewolf could heal fully but, be reduced to the state of a simpleton who over time could possibly relearn skills, etc. But in this case I see that werewolf having a completely different personality as everything it was, experiences education, etc prior to the damage was lost.
5) Massive damage (ie a safe, care, dumptruck, etc dropped on a werewolf. or being hit by a car at a high rate of speed, falling from a tall building ) Depending on the damage sustained, many of these injuries may kill a person but would could conceivable be healable depending on how much damage was done. I like the idea of loose your head for any reason and a werewolf is done. Or, cause enough trauma to the brain and again done. This catagory would also include being impaled on something. If you can't get yourself off of the big piece of rebar sticking through your body and eventually the regeneration thing will no longer help. Also depending on what part of the body is stuck you may or may not live or live longer. With the ability to quickly close wounds around an arrow, spear, peice of rebar etc sticking out/through you, you could be up and about but, of course be in a gereat deal of pain at the same time.
6) lightining/electricity.... In high enough amperage, electeicution works much the same as fire...only from the inside out. Electricity/lightning for example is very hot. that is why metals melt (if not properly grounded) stone shatters, wood catches fire etc. Again, it would depend on the amperage and duration of the exposure to determine if a werewolf would be done.
7) Severe cold... A werewolf would most probably be able to resist cold far better than a person. But, unless its cells have built in antifreeze like many bugs or frogs, when it thawed out the cellular damage would be beyond repair. ( the ice crystals that form in things like you and me while freeezing, pierce the cell walls of every cell in your body as they form. so when you thaw out everything is damaged. This is the dilemma that cryogenics has not solved ...yet. )
my $.02 worth
Der Wuerger
always the dead guy, when do I get a speaking part...
always the dead guy, when do I get a speaking part...
Since you asked nice, heres my opinion (Note: Opinion, feel free to get your own).
Silver: This is a bad idea, it has no ties to the historical werewolf, and would end the world. If you could only kill something with silver, it would have eaten/killed every man/woman/child before mankind developed the metalurgical know-how to mine the stuff in the first place. IMHO, the time for the "silver bullet" idea has passed. Except maybe as a beer slogan.
And storywise, nobody can ever think of a good reason for the silver bullet idea. Why cant they starve? or be strangled, or freeze to death? or catch AIDS?, or be burned at the stake?, or drown?, or get crushed by a Peterbilt?, or get sucked-out of an airlock and explode in the icy depths of space?
Full Moons: Unlike silver, full moons at least have a basis in the real world. For some unknown reason the full moon phase (and the sanguine moon too) just makes people a little bit bonkers. Police departments and Rescue Squads almost always have a minor upswing in business during a full moon. Thus it kinda makes sense that someone would be more vulnerable to a Lycanthropic disorder during a full moon.
Dogs hate them: I'm not going to argue the science behind "werewolf pheremones", but logically, if a werewolf were in human form... then (s)he shouldn't smell any different than his/her normal self.
What form?
There are three basic forms to werewolves. 1) Guy with furry face 2) quadraped animal, and 3) biped hybrid.
Nobody likes the furry face.
As for the animal or hybrid thats a toss-up. They both have their pros & cons.
Animal: The four legged eating monster is the historical basis for lycanthropy. Since Zeus turned king Lycaon into a wolf for cannibalism, to medieval folklore of intelligent, evil child attackers, to the mental disorder that people think they've become wolves; the "big scary dog" is the way to go. Ginger Snaps and An American Werewolf in London both featured this kind of werewolf.
Hybrid: The two legged, lupine-headed monster is the new badboy on the block. A product of hollywood and perfected in 1981's The Howling the hybrid monster is possibly the most frightening, and with its opposable-thumbed hands.. possible the best killer. The downside is that its incredibly hard to pull-off in a movie. CG monsters tend to look...well, FAKE (VanHellsing, Harry Potter), rubber suits have the problem of disproportianate heads (Underworld had good leg work..but the heads/necks were horribly fashioned so people could see in the suit). The only way to make it work, in my opinion, would be on a mixture of animatronics and puppetry.
Other Miscellanious
Transformation: If you're shooting for any kind of realism in your movie, lycanthropy should be a one-way street. Like a butterfly trying to turn back into a caterpillar, a werewolf should no longer be able to go back to human. Remember that lycanthropes are also metaphores for mental health.. once you pop, you can't stop. In addition a transformation should take days/weeks at least.
However if you're making a straight fantasy/horror film: Then the idea of the werewolf being able to hide in its human form becomes a legitimate story goal. But in any case: Don't CG the transformation. It looks bad (as most CG does). If you can do it on-camera.. don't do it at all.
reproduction: The heart of the idea is that unless your the first werewolf (God's punishment for cannibalism?), the scary factor of werewolves is that you become one. Thus a werewolf isn't born so much as made. I'd just say that werewolves become sterile after their transformation is complete.
Build: Figure a fullgrown man weighs between 170 and 250 (very thin and very fat people aside). Now these numbers are easy to tabulate in wolf form: A werewolf, in a full animal form, should be about the size of an Irish Wolfhound, maybe a little "meatier". But stretch 200lbs over a tall biped frame (most werewolves are usually rendered tall) and suddenly 200lbs isnt very much. A hybrid monster would likely be very thin ( such as in Harry Potter 3).
Remember your basic science: Matter cannot be created or destroyed, it can only change form. When you transform.. it has to go somewhere...
Regeneration: I have no idea where this comes from.
It makes no sense that something should be able to regrow body parts, with the exception of starfish and iguanas. Now if you're making a werestarfish or wereiguana movie then have at it... otherwise its a bad idea.
IN Short: Just think about the hows and whys of how this organism fits into society, and common sense will guide you as to what it should do.
Silver: This is a bad idea, it has no ties to the historical werewolf, and would end the world. If you could only kill something with silver, it would have eaten/killed every man/woman/child before mankind developed the metalurgical know-how to mine the stuff in the first place. IMHO, the time for the "silver bullet" idea has passed. Except maybe as a beer slogan.
And storywise, nobody can ever think of a good reason for the silver bullet idea. Why cant they starve? or be strangled, or freeze to death? or catch AIDS?, or be burned at the stake?, or drown?, or get crushed by a Peterbilt?, or get sucked-out of an airlock and explode in the icy depths of space?Full Moons: Unlike silver, full moons at least have a basis in the real world. For some unknown reason the full moon phase (and the sanguine moon too) just makes people a little bit bonkers. Police departments and Rescue Squads almost always have a minor upswing in business during a full moon. Thus it kinda makes sense that someone would be more vulnerable to a Lycanthropic disorder during a full moon.
Dogs hate them: I'm not going to argue the science behind "werewolf pheremones", but logically, if a werewolf were in human form... then (s)he shouldn't smell any different than his/her normal self.
What form?
There are three basic forms to werewolves. 1) Guy with furry face 2) quadraped animal, and 3) biped hybrid.
Nobody likes the furry face.
As for the animal or hybrid thats a toss-up. They both have their pros & cons.
Animal: The four legged eating monster is the historical basis for lycanthropy. Since Zeus turned king Lycaon into a wolf for cannibalism, to medieval folklore of intelligent, evil child attackers, to the mental disorder that people think they've become wolves; the "big scary dog" is the way to go. Ginger Snaps and An American Werewolf in London both featured this kind of werewolf.
Hybrid: The two legged, lupine-headed monster is the new badboy on the block. A product of hollywood and perfected in 1981's The Howling the hybrid monster is possibly the most frightening, and with its opposable-thumbed hands.. possible the best killer. The downside is that its incredibly hard to pull-off in a movie. CG monsters tend to look...well, FAKE (VanHellsing, Harry Potter), rubber suits have the problem of disproportianate heads (Underworld had good leg work..but the heads/necks were horribly fashioned so people could see in the suit). The only way to make it work, in my opinion, would be on a mixture of animatronics and puppetry.
Other Miscellanious
Transformation: If you're shooting for any kind of realism in your movie, lycanthropy should be a one-way street. Like a butterfly trying to turn back into a caterpillar, a werewolf should no longer be able to go back to human. Remember that lycanthropes are also metaphores for mental health.. once you pop, you can't stop. In addition a transformation should take days/weeks at least.
However if you're making a straight fantasy/horror film: Then the idea of the werewolf being able to hide in its human form becomes a legitimate story goal. But in any case: Don't CG the transformation. It looks bad (as most CG does). If you can do it on-camera.. don't do it at all.
reproduction: The heart of the idea is that unless your the first werewolf (God's punishment for cannibalism?), the scary factor of werewolves is that you become one. Thus a werewolf isn't born so much as made. I'd just say that werewolves become sterile after their transformation is complete.
Build: Figure a fullgrown man weighs between 170 and 250 (very thin and very fat people aside). Now these numbers are easy to tabulate in wolf form: A werewolf, in a full animal form, should be about the size of an Irish Wolfhound, maybe a little "meatier". But stretch 200lbs over a tall biped frame (most werewolves are usually rendered tall) and suddenly 200lbs isnt very much. A hybrid monster would likely be very thin ( such as in Harry Potter 3).
Remember your basic science: Matter cannot be created or destroyed, it can only change form. When you transform.. it has to go somewhere...
Regeneration: I have no idea where this comes from.
It makes no sense that something should be able to regrow body parts, with the exception of starfish and iguanas. Now if you're making a werestarfish or wereiguana movie then have at it... otherwise its a bad idea.IN Short: Just think about the hows and whys of how this organism fits into society, and common sense will guide you as to what it should do.
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Apokryltaros
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I think it should be less vunerable to normal attacks than a human, after all, it'd have increased healing (or at least I think it should). Silver is good, but just silver bullets shouldn't completely kill it unless they stay in for a while or hit major/important organs. Like, they would be able to pull out the bullet (if they could).
Also, when they touch/are hit/shot at with silver, the silver should sizzle on them, like burning, but with no flames.
Another good idea for a silver weapon for monster/werewolf hunters are silver nitrate bullets, that way the silver enters their blood stream. That way there's nothing to pull out.
Also, just as a side note, I love werewolves and would side with them anytime. I'm just suggesting these things to make the movie better.
Also, when they touch/are hit/shot at with silver, the silver should sizzle on them, like burning, but with no flames.
Another good idea for a silver weapon for monster/werewolf hunters are silver nitrate bullets, that way the silver enters their blood stream. That way there's nothing to pull out.
Also, just as a side note, I love werewolves and would side with them anytime. I'm just suggesting these things to make the movie better.
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Apokryltaros
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Exactly how do you propose to make a bullet out of a chemical that looks like gray water, and is of the exact same consistancy of water?Bladewing wrote: Another good idea for a silver weapon for monster/werewolf hunters are silver nitrate bullets, that way the silver enters their blood stream. That way there's nothing to pull out.