Can a werewolf be cured?

[CrewWolf]

In movies, it seems the most oftenly used cure is that you have to kill the werewolf that passed it down to you. That way has always sounded kind of ridiculous to me and serves more of a horror aspect more than anything.
Other times there are perhaps some special rituals that can be done involving all sorts of herbs I've never heard of except for Wolfbane, and then dancing naked in the night. Unless these werewolves we're talking about have more of an occult and magickal nature, that method is just kind of...well, you know.
Of course the easy thing to do would just say that werewolves can't be cured due to the complications involved but I think we can do better than that.
Does anybody have any ideas?

[Bete]

Hi CrewWolf, according to some French Creole folk tales, yes a werewolf can be cured, here's a famous link regarding that:
http://rking.vinu.edu/page.htm

[Figarou]

I can see one that was bitten being cured. But what about a pure born werewolf? The werewolf side is so much part of him/her.


Edit

Hmm...most other films has a time limit. One can only be cured if you do it before a certain time. After that, your stuck as a werewolf.

But I'm sick of the midnight crap. What does time have to do with being a werewolf?

[Silverfang]

I dunno, you'd think once the virus has intergrated itself into the host's body, then removing it would almost certainly kill them as it keeps them alive during the shift but thats my opinion

Yay finally got my Avantar working

[Darkmoon]

weeell viruses are incureable..if it was a virus I don't think a werewolf could get rid of it.

[Figarou]

weeell viruses are incureable..if it was a virus I don't think a werewolf could get rid of it.

Viruses can be killed. White blood cells attack anything that doesn't belong in the body. The virus can hide in the body by matching with the proteins in its surroundings.


Man, I'm not even a doctor and I know this stuff. freaky!!

[Terastas]

It really depends. If there was a sort of vaccine for lycanthropy, someone could theoretically cure himself if recently infected. After a while, however, the person's body will adapt to the presence of lycanthropy, specifically the enhanced regeneration. It's possible that, at this point, any attempt to "cure" the individual could be fatal.

Then there's the controversy of the whole "curing" process. I imagine the idea of magic - especially witchcraft - is right out. That said, we can rule out the processes of killing the werewolf that infected the individual, as well as any potential ritual cures.

That leaves herbal remedies, but to the best of my knowledge, the only two herbs legends state can cure lycanthropy are Wolfsbane and Deadly Nightshade, neither of which I would recommend trying. It might be possible to disinfect a werewolf bite with one (by a specialist, of course), but I doubt it could be used to treat lycanthropy any other way.

[WolfVanZandt]

Terastas, that might workfor the movie but realistically vaccine don't cure viral illnesses; they prevent them. There are very few viruses that can actually be killed in the body because they're made of DNA. If you kill them, you also kill off the body's DNA.

If it is a virus, realistically, itcould only be cured if the body itself could fight it off.

If it's magic, then any of the old cues would be acceptible.

In the old legends (THe Contendings of the Apostles, some of the life histories of St. Christopher, etc, lycanthropy could be cured by a holy man.

[Figarou]

Terastas, that might workfor the movie but realistically vaccine don't cure viral illnesses; they prevent them. There are very few viruses that can actually be killed in the body because they're made of DNA. If you kill them, you also kill off the body's DNA.

If it is a virus, realistically, itcould only be cured if the body itself could fight it off.

If it's magic, then any of the old cues would be acceptible.

In the old legends (THe Contendings of the Apostles, some of the life histories of St. Christopher, etc, lycanthropy could be cured by a holy man.

I find it odd that a virus is causing lycanthropy. Where did it come from? Why does the infected resemble a wolf instead of an alien form? Why can't it be a runaway gene instead of a virus.

[Apokryltaros]

Terastas, that might workfor the movie but realistically vaccine don't cure viral illnesses; they prevent them. There are very few viruses that can actually be killed in the body because they're made of DNA. If you kill them, you also kill off the body's DNA.

If it is a virus, realistically, itcould only be cured if the body itself could fight it off.

If it's magic, then any of the old cues would be acceptible.

In the old legends (THe Contendings of the Apostles, some of the life histories of St. Christopher, etc, lycanthropy could be cured by a holy man.

I find it odd that a virus is causing lycanthropy. Where did it come from? Why does the infected resemble a wolf instead of an alien form? Why can't it be a runaway gene instead of a virus.

It is known that some virii are capable of taking a gene from one host and inserting it into another. Perhaps lycanthropy was a virus that received some magically malignant help?

[Figarou]

It is known that some virii are capable of taking a gene from one host and inserting it into another. Perhaps lycanthropy was a virus that received some magically malignant help?

Would be so nice if werewolves really exsisted. Doing research and finding the truth would be so much easier. But werewolves don't exsist.


Doing a search on the internet now will only give me other peoples thoughts, ideas, and stories about lycanthropy and its cause. Everybody has something different in mind about it. Oh well. Just let it be. Don't want to get more confused.

[Apokryltaros]

weeell viruses are incureable..if it was a virus I don't think a werewolf could get rid of it.

A virus can not be killed, in that, it is not alive. Like Figarou said, though, a virus can be destroyed by a person's immune system, provided it isn't overwhelmed or compromised.

That leaves herbal remedies, but to the best of my knowledge, the only two herbs legends state can cure lycanthropy are Wolfsbane and Deadly Nightshade, neither of which I would recommend trying. It might be possible to disinfect a werewolf bite with one (by a specialist, of course), but I doubt it could be used to treat lycanthropy any other way.

As far as my own research goes, there have been no spells using Wolfsbane to cure people of lycanthropy. The only spells/rituals that I know of to cure lycanthropy, involving plants, involved beating the target with switches of ash or yew in order to cast out the evil spirit within. Dungeons and Dragons, in its 2nd edition, had a rumor that ingesting Bella Donna, aka Deadly Nightshade, may provide a chance of evading the contagin.

Terastas, that might workfor the movie but realistically vaccine don't cure viral illnesses; they prevent them. There are very few viruses that can actually be killed in the body because they're made of DNA. If you kill them, you also kill off the body's DNA.

If it is a virus, realistically, itcould only be cured if the body itself could fight it off.

Virii have either RNA or DNA as a core. Viral vaccines work by exciting the body's immune system through injection of harmless versions of the virus, or parts of the virus (either the protein coat or its DNA/RNA) into the body.
You're probably thinking of how a virus can not be targetted while in its host cell.

[WolfVanZandt]

My speculation is pretty much as Apokryltaros said. But that's just one possibility. A runaway gene would work just as well. In that case, gene therapy might work, but that's future stuff. We don't have the technology yet.

And there were people between the 5th and 15th century that were called Werewolves and they were often respected members of their communities and not thought of as monsters. But they weren't much like fictional Werewolves and the Modern Therian Community is a continuation of those people ... not that that would be much help for the movie.

[Figarou]

weeell viruses are incureable..if it was a virus I don't think a werewolf could get rid of it.

A virus can not be killed, in that, it is not alive. Like Figarou said, though, a virus can be destroyed by a person's immune system, provided it isn't overwhelmed or compromised.

Really? Not alive? It grows, divides, moves around, and its not alive?

*raises one eye brow* Fasinating.

[WolfVanZandt]

Nope, not alive - not in a scientific sense. It's just a strand of DNA or RNA that might have a protien coating. It just so happens that this complex molecule can splice itself into the genetic mechanism of a cell and cause duplicates of itself to be manufactured But reproduction isn't the only requirement for life (If so, metal ions that plate themselves out of solutions in crystal form would be considered alive). There's also the requirement of homeostasis. If you place a living system into a different environment, it will readjust itself physiologically, to be better able to survive in that environment. For instance a human placed in a cold enviromnet will shiver to produce more body heat. It will also shunt more blood to the body core in an attempt to keep it warm.

If you take a virus out of it's optimal "growing" environment - it simply falls apart like the unstable organic molecule that it is.

Which brings me to my idea of where viruses came from - an organism dies and it's DNA survive long enough for it's instable nature to cause a change that will make it able to take over the cellular mechanism of another organism. What if the organism that died was a wolf?

Heh, don't try this in your reality but I think, for fiction, it's rather provocative.

[Scott Gardener]

The body's immune system can neutralize viruses that are outside of cells, but the body can't specifically remove viral DNA from cells that have already integrated the material into its nucleus. The body instead instructs those cells to self-destruct.

Someone infected by genetic viral lycanthropy would have every cell modified with viral DNA, and the immune system would have been overwhelmed and eventually coaxed by the virus itself into working with instead of against the infection, otherwise the werewolf would be plagued by autoimmune problems. (Ironically, there's an autoimmune disease called lupus.)

So, an antivirus drug, herb, or what-not might prevent the initial infection, but once you've got it, you're going to need extensive twenty-second century nanomolecular surgery or a transplant of your consciousness into a new body to get rid of it.

[WolfVanZandt]

You're right Scott.

The way I visualize a Werewolf's physiology (and I'm certainly not suggesting it for the movie, particularly) is that there are two factors invloved in lycanthropy. There's an inherited genetic factor that predisposes people to it and causes certain genetic traits and then there's a viral component that floats around in the bloodstream that actually causes the transformation.

Some Werewolves carry the transformation factor from conception because it passes the placental barrier. Other families have lost the factor but can pick it up be exchange of body fluids (as in a bite). So if a nonlycanthropic individual is bitten and survives the mauling, he needs to get a tetnus shot because Werewolf bites are nasty. But if the bitten individual comes from a lycanthropic family, they pick up the ability to shift.

[Scott Gardener]

Interesting solution, as it combines both popular means of acquiring the thing. It also solves the issue of population created by the infectious bite.

[Treads Lightly]

Perhaps “cure” is too strong of a word, how about "treatment"? It appears that once someone is infected with lycanthropy to the point they begin to shift it is too late to actually cure them. However, perhaps there are herbal or other medications that could cause the were in question to be less likely to shift. I am thinking in particular to the link that has been stated between shifting and adrenaline in the system.

[WolfVanZandt]

Yeah. I've thought about adrenaline as the trigger for the shift. But adrenaline can be controlled by mind over body techniques. I guess you could get an adrenaline blocker. The way I see itworking, adrenaline binds to a few cells and creates a place for the first virus that comes along to transfer into the cell. Along with altering the cells metabolism and structure, if causes the cell to excrete other chemicals including adrenaline which triggers off neighboring cells until the transformation is complete. The pituitary is under conscious control in the Werewolf and excretes the counter hormone that starts the reverse reaction that detaches the lycanthropic DNA and ejects it from the cells. Since both chemicals remain in the blood stream until the excess is metabolized by the liver, there's a refactory period between shifts where the Werewolf can't shift.

[Figarou]

Its so good to live in today's world. Science and medical technology can be a wonderfull thing. Imagine what the conversation will be like if the 2 wasn't involved.

magic this, witchcraft that, demon possession, yuck!! I'm sick of that stuff.

[WolfVanZandt]

Well, even doctors can't go that far. They run into things all the time that they call "miraculous". The human mind is more intimately involved in our health and welfare than science would have accepted just a few years ago. Now we know that there's a powerful psychological factor in very physical diseases as cancer, diabetes, and even simple healing. If you're mentally and spiritually healthy, you will heal injuries faster. There is very good, very strong research that indicates that prayer (in a double blind study where the prayer didn't even know the person that they were praying for and the prayee didn't know they were being prayed for) significantly improves survival rate in people with cardiac disorders. There are cases of people with multiple personality disorder that have a completely healthy alter and one who has a diagnosable disease such as diabetes (how in the world can that happen?). There are very well documanted cases of people who have died simply because they had a curse put on them.

There is a subjective side to the universe that science has problems with. We can't ignore the mind and spirit yet.

And if you check the Therian sites, you will notice that RL Werewolves are still very concerned about the world of the spirit.

[Figarou]

I never heard of a Therian until I came to this forum. Do you mind explaining what it is.

[Lasthowl]

I never heard of a Therian until I came to this forum. Do you mind explaining what it is.

I've usually heard it used to refer to "spiritual weres."

Usually involves autohypnosis and belief that you're a were_____ even if you can't physically shift.

[WolfVanZandt]

Heh. I would if I could, but you have to understand that, although we've known that we were what we are for about two generations, we've only known that there were others like us (thanks to the Internet) since 1993. So we're working on answers.

I can tell you what we're not. We're not RPGers. In fact, although some of us (occassionally play games, we never really get into it like most RPGers do). Although our culture overlaps some with the Furry culture, Therian and Furry are two completely different things. We're not crazy, because we live productive, more or less enjoyable lives. I'm very successful in that I've already achieved all my life goals and am workng now on enriching my accomlishments. And we didn't choose to be what we are. You're either born Therian or you're not THerian (some realize what's going on later in life, though).

Most of us (I'm not going to say all because some unusual cases have come to my attention lately) have a strong internal identification of ourselves as some kind of nonhuman animal. It can run a contnuum from a nagging doubt to an absolute certainty. I have a phantom body (like many people with amputations have phantom limbs) that is like a overlay of my physical body that is a big black wolf. It's not normal for a wolf's physical makeup. It's so perceptible by me that I can often use the "tail" to maintain balance.

I believe that we are a continuation of the people that were called Werewolves in tha early Middle Ages. Modern fictional Werewolves are indirectly inspired by those people but they did exist and we exist know with many similarities to them.

That our difference are physiological, I have absolutely no doubt. It's driven home rather painfully by the fact that I have the inflammatory disorders that we have a predisposition to. There are also slight physical differences, but we're trying to work out just how significant they are.