Astrology

Fenrir · Post by **Fenrir** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 11:35 pm

Amon is confusing too he at one time replaced Ra but was later merged with him but he was either brought in by invaders or some crazy pharoah made him. But he was just Ra with two little buildings on his head. But I am not sure. So I could be wrong I have to read up on my Egyptian mythology when I get home though for sure

vrikasatma · Post by **vrikasatma** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 11:47 pm

Amon was the God of things unseen and unmanifest — therefore, could be considered a kind of "chaos" god (or at least really paradoxical). Ra — well, okay, He's a Sun God. I can understand the power He wielded because if it weren't for the Sun, we wouldn't be here. Period, paragraph, end of story. Earth is very good, but don't amount to much if there's no spark of life.

The Egyptians obviously knew this, too, and put the Sun in the highest position of their pantheon. Each deity had their own following — think of thousands of different denominations without a real centralized authority — and the followings rose and fell in influence and popularity according to the political movers and shakers within their own number. If the governor of a nome — a subkingdom — followed Bast or Sutekh or Heru — then the deity he followed rose in hierarchical prominence and was attached to Ra. So we have Ra-Heru-Khuit, Amon-Ra, et alia. So the combining of deities was a political thing that turned, over the centuries, into a mystical/scholarly thing.

The other cool thing about the mythology is that if you want a deity of such-and-such and there wasn't an established archetypal figurehead for it, you could link two deities and their influence/archetypes could combine and create a new deity. This is where you get Herusuty (Horus + Set), Serapis (Ausir-Apet, Osiris + Ptah), Ptah-tennen (Ptah + Djehuty/Thoth), and so on. I have two Egytpain armband tattoos of the rising sun and descending moon, rising over the backs of Aker-Apuautu (Aker god of the horizon + Ap-Uautu, Opener of the Ways) and Aker-Amentiu (Aker + Khenti-Amentiu, "Lord of the Hidden Lands," the mystic in the Lycopolitan triad). The Egyptian pantheon was VERY malleable and changed A LOT. The story of Iset and Ausir didn't happen until relatively late; Iset (Isis) came first and Her first consort was Khenti-Amentiu.

By the way...it should go noted...Ptah is still actively propitiated. The Freemasons started as part of His Cult and went 'way underground when Christianity rose. When a Mason goes to court, he doesn't swear on the Bible, but by declaring "I swear by the Supreme Architect of the Universe." He is referring to Ptah, not Jehovah.

Fenrir · Post by **Fenrir** » Sun Jan 01, 2006 11:54 pm

vrikasatma wrote:Amon was the God of things unseen and unmanifest — therefore, could be considered a kind of "chaos" god (or at least really paradoxical). Ra — well, okay, He's a Sun God. I can understand the power He wielded because if it weren't for the Sun, we wouldn't be here. Period, paragraph, end of story. Earth is very good, but don't amount to much if there's no spark of life.

The Egyptians obviously knew this, too, and put the Sun in the highest position of their pantheon. Each deity had their own following — think of thousands of different denominations without a real centralized authority — and the followings rose and fell in influence and popularity according to the political movers and shakers within their own number. If the governor of a nome — a subkingdom — followed Bast or Sutekh or Heru — then the deity he followed rose in hierarchical prominence and was attached to Ra. So we have Ra-Heru-Khuit, Amon-Ra, et alia. So the combining of deities was a political thing that turned, over the centuries, into a mystical/scholarly thing.

The other cool thing about the mythology is that if you want a deity of such-and-such and there wasn't an established archetypal figurehead for it, you could link two deities and their influence/archetypes could combine and create a new deity. This is where you get Herusuty (Horus + Set), Serapis (Ausir-Apet, Osiris + Ptah), Ptah-tennen (Ptah + Djehuty/Thoth), and so on. I have two Egytpain armband tattoos of the rising sun and descending moon, rising over the backs of Aker-Apuautu (Aker god of the horizon + Ap-Uautu, Opener of the Ways) and Aker-Amentiu (Aker + Khenti-Amentiu, "Lord of the Hidden Lands," the mystic in the Lycopolitan triad). The Egyptian pantheon was VERY malleable and changed A LOT. The story of Iset and Ausir didn't happen until relatively late; Iset (Isis) came first and Her first consort was Khenti-Amentiu.

By the way...it should go noted...Ptah is still actively propitiated. The Freemasons started as part of His Cult and went 'way underground when Christianity rose. When a Mason goes to court, he doesn't swear on the Bible, but by declaring "I swear by the Supreme Architect of the Universe." He is referring to Ptah, not Jehovah.

see this is why I have to reread Egyptian mythology. But I am confused i have been looking through a few websites and many of them swap gods around or rename them for instance one site labels Ra as the king and sun god, while another labels Ra as the sun itself and Horus as the king of the gods as well as the sun god. I hate all this dynasty stuff I hate how the Hyksos and Assyrians took over and twisted their religeon don't you?

Shadow Wulf · Post by **Shadow Wulf** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:01 am

Religion and mythology leads to madness I tell you.

Fenrir · Post by **Fenrir** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:04 am

Don't get me started on the European mythologies! But I love to talk mythology with anybody as well as religeon, but sadly most people I know say it's a waste of time

and won't listen.

Madness you give it too little credit it will make you Hanibal lector crazy and that's good crazy.

BTW: why Hanibal he almost destroyed Rome and all but why not Cato he was crazier

Shadow Wulf · Post by **Shadow Wulf** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:06 am

I love Mythology, I borrowed the game Age of Mythology from my friend and its pretty fun, My favorite is the Egyptian Mythology, probably due to Anubis who I always worship.

Fenrir · Post by **Fenrir** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:09 am

Bah I could beat you with Zues anytime anyplace there aint noone that god can't beat as long as he worships Athene Apollo and hera!

Do you still have the game id likr to play ya sometime

BTW don't play the Egyptians on deathmatch they're not worth it

vrikasatma · Post by **vrikasatma** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 1:50 am

My advice? Don't read the books. A lot of them are based on Budge's "work" (most of which he plagiarized from his students, he was also bigoted and thought the Greeks were superior to the Egyptians), and most of the rest is a mishmash of New Age backlash against Budge (and also full of Greco-centricity and pseudo-conspiracy theory) or part of the African Pride revival (sometimes thinly-disguised reverse racism).

Egypt (Kemi) was a cosmopolitan country. Calling it "African" would be like calling America a European country. They had pretty much every ethnicity represented from Ireland to Nubia to Greece there. It was one of the most cosmopolitan states in the ancient world: all you had to do was join a cult, pay tribute to Pharaoh and take an Egyptian name and you were in.

If you're going to read anything, pick Faulkner over Budge. He had a bit more respect for the material and reapproached it from another, more scholarly angle. "Coming Into the Light" and "Flight From Egypt" are good ones too, if you can track them down. Bottom line, ignore the hell out of Budge!

As for me...
I go on archetypes. Sure, it's Jungian, but it strips away all the nonsensical crystal-waving and "Book of the Dead" claptrap. Heru (Horus) was the hero — there's a million stories based on His legend, and actually He wasn't the lantern-jawed, teflon-haired in-a-waving-cape brand of hero, either. He was more like Siegfried, tragic, bloody and driven. He wanted Sutekh's a** so badly He was willing to kill anyone who stood in His way, and He wound up losing an eye into the bargain. I don't really consider Him a sun-god, unless we're talking about Ra-Harakhty.

Then again, that's from the Iset-Ausir-Heliopolitan end of the spectrum. My trad is more like the Memphite, which was Ptah-Sekhmet-Djehuty. Heliopolitan is more for the "common folk" and royalty, Memphite was for the more spiritually-inclined. Think Orthodox-Monastic dichotomy. Earth's good, Sun's important, but Someone had to give the cogwheels a kick and create both.

Darum · Post by **Darum** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:53 am

Fenrir wrote:
Ancient wrote:Being half Native American I know I have other totem animals as well. They have been determined by a tribe shaman. I will take this oppertunity to list them. They are:

Dog
Noble, faithful, loyal, teaching, protection, guidance

Deer
Intellectual, gentle, caring, kind, subtlety, gracefulness, femininity, gentleness, innocence, luring to new adventure

Fox
Cunning, agility, quick-witted, diplomacy, wildness, feminine magic of camouflage, shapeshifting and invisibility

Lion
Family, strength, energy, courage

There are a few others but I already know I've told you more than you wish to know.
Your Native American wow your lucky your family cares about their heritage My great grandfather denied his haritage of Cherrokee for some reason, so i have not had the privalage to talk to a shaman. I find it funny that they are called "totem" animals because totems are from North West America and Canada!

another Cherrokee? well aren't we the abundant bunch!

eh, my Gradparents denied their heritage too, it was because it was a common belief (atleast in their area) that "indians" were nothing but drunks who couldn't do a thing for themselves...

Fenrir · Post by **Fenrir** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 10:53 am

vrikasatma wrote:My advice? Don't read the books. A lot of them are based on Budge's "work" (most of which he plagiarized from his students, he was also bigoted and thought the Greeks were superior to the Egyptians), and most of the rest is a mishmash of New Age backlash against Budge (and also full of Greco-centricity and pseudo-conspiracy theory) or part of the African Pride revival (sometimes thinly-disguised reverse racism).

Egypt (Kemi) was a cosmopolitan country. Calling it "African" would be like calling America a European country. They had pretty much every ethnicity represented from Ireland to Nubia to Greece there. It was one of the most cosmopolitan states in the ancient world: all you had to do was join a cult, pay tribute to Pharaoh and take an Egyptian name and you were in.

If you're going to read anything, pick Faulkner over Budge. He had a bit more respect for the material and reapproached it from another, more scholarly angle. "Coming Into the Light" and "Flight From Egypt" are good ones too, if you can track them down. Bottom line, ignore the hell out of Budge!

As for me...
I go on archetypes. Sure, it's Jungian, but it strips away all the nonsensical crystal-waving and "Book of the Dead" claptrap. Heru (Horus) was the hero — there's a million stories based on His legend, and actually He wasn't the lantern-jawed, teflon-haired in-a-waving-cape brand of hero, either. He was more like Siegfried, tragic, bloody and driven. He wanted Sutekh's a** so badly He was willing to kill anyone who stood in His way, and He wound up losing an eye into the bargain. I don't really consider Him a sun-god, unless we're talking about Ra-Harakhty.

Then again, that's from the Iset-Ausir-Heliopolitan end of the spectrum. My trad is more like the Memphite, which was Ptah-Sekhmet-Djehuty. Heliopolitan is more for the "common folk" and royalty, Memphite was for the more spiritually-inclined. Think Orthodox-Monastic dichotomy. Earth's good, Sun's important, but Someone had to give the cogwheels a kick and create both.

Thank you I was just going to read the section of Egyptian mythology in The Encyclopedia of Mythology.

This is why I don't like Egyptian Mythology compared to others it's somewhat more confusing then Hindu Mythology (which isn't that confusing but just somewhat weird) at times Egyptian Mythology is going a long and then it says something completely different then what was said before and I hate that Non Sequiter part of it.

another Cherrokee? well aren't we the abundant bunch! eh, my Gradparents denied their heritage too, it was because it was a common belief (atleast in their area) that "indians" were nothing but drunks who couldn't do a thing for themselves...

Isn't it sad when people get facts wrong from the sway of the mob who hated things that were different its sad but thats how the world works you have the better weapons you win the wars you make the rules, plain and simple sad but true that's how thousands of cultures died out such as the Bantu and the Aztecs.

Don't you hate when things go like that

Shadow Wulf · Post by **Shadow Wulf** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 10:56 am

Fenrir wrote:Bah I could beat you with Zues anytime anyplace there aint noone that god can't beat as long as he worships Athene Apollo and hera!

Do you still have the game id likr to play ya sometime

BTW don't play the Egyptians on deathmatch they're not worth it

But the Egyptions have the most powerful Unit in the whole game, I forgot what is hes called.

Darum · Post by **Darum** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:53 pm

Fenrir wrote:

another Cherrokee? well aren't we the abundant bunch! eh, my Gradparents denied their heritage too, it was because it was a common belief (atleast in their area) that "indians" were nothing but drunks who couldn't do a thing for themselves...
Isn't it sad when people get facts wrong from the sway of the mob who hated things that were different its sad but thats how the world works you have the better weapons you win the wars you make the rules, plain and simple sad but true that's how thousands of cultures died out such as the Bantu and the Aztecs.

Don't you hate when things go like that

i agree, it's just one more reason i should take over the world... though, i'd probobly only make a good military leader, if that...

Shadow Wulf · Post by **Shadow Wulf** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 1:09 pm

Judging by your avatar, you just might.

Fenrir · Post by **Fenrir** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 6:45 pm

Shadow Wulf wrote:
Fenrir wrote:Bah I could beat you with Zues anytime anyplace there aint noone that god can't beat as long as he worships Athene Apollo and hera!

Do you still have the game id likr to play ya sometime

BTW don't play the Egyptians on deathmatch they're not worth it
But the Egyptions have the most powerful Unit in the whole game, I forgot what is hes called.

The sun of Osiris? or the titan?

Darth Canis · Post by **Darth Canis** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:26 pm

Birthday: Feb. 19, 1985

Western: Pices
Chinese: Rat
Egyptian: Geb
Celtic: The ash tree
Native American: Cougar

vrikasatma · Post by **vrikasatma** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 8:25 pm

Fenrir wrote:The sun of Osiris?

Waitaminnit...Osiris is an earth-god!
Gods, what ARE they teaching in schools these days?!

Fenrir · Post by **Fenrir** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 8:27 pm

vrikasatma wrote:
Fenrir wrote:The sun of Osiris?
Waitaminnit...Osiris is an earth-god!
Gods, what ARE they teaching in schools these days?!

For me nothing new and deffinately nothing about Egypt so i have an excuse

But ya stupid spelling

Ancient · Post by **Ancient** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 9:22 pm

another Cherrokee? well aren't we the abundant bunch! eh, my Gradparents denied their heritage too, it was because it was a common belief (atleast in their area) that "indians" were nothing but drunks who couldn't do a thing for themselves...

I myself am half Cherokee we do seem rather abundant. My family being pure "indian" on one side faught for their heritage. As did my irish side seeing as they are spiritualist (a branch off of Druidism) although I don't know much about either of those religions.

Fenrir wrote: sn't it sad when people get facts wrong from the sway of the mob who hated things that were different its sad but thats how the world works you have the better weapons you win the wars you make the rules, plain and simple sad but true that's how thousands of cultures died out such as the Bantu and the Aztecs. Don't you hate when things go like that

Yes I agree Fenrir it is sad when people don't take the oppertunity to learn from another culture and instead seek out to destroy what they don't understand.

celtwolf · Post by **celtwolf** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 9:30 pm

western: leo
chinese: rabbit
egyptian: Sekhmet
celtic: The Hazel Tree (Coll)
Native American: sturgeon!

Timber-WoIf · Post by **Timber-WoIf** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 11:22 am

Western: Scorpio
Chinese: (school web blocks won't let me see Yahoo)
Egyptian: Sekhmet
Celtic: The Reed (Ngetal)
Native American: Snake

huh... i got wierd ones... mabie 50% accurrate...
....wtf does it mean 'femininity'?

Darum · Post by **Darum** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 11:29 am

Timber-WoIf wrote:wtf does it mean 'femininity'?

Girl-ishness...?

Ronkonkoma · Post by **Ronkonkoma** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 1:24 pm

hmmm, astrology huh? lemme see what google can help me find today.....

Western: Gemini
Egyptian: Set
Celtic: The Oak Tree
Chinese: Dog (Brown Dragon, born in the year of the Black Dog)
Chinese Element: Earth
Native American: Deer
Color: Green
Numerology: 4
Aztec: Cozcaquauhtli (The Vulture)
Planet: Mercury
Zodiac Element: Air
Zodiac Angel: Ambriel
Alchemy sign: Quicksilver
Nakshatra: Shatabhistha (Satabhisha)
birthstone: Moonstone

http://www.chineseastrologyonline.com/2006.htm
http://www.astrostar.com/AztecAstrology.htm
http://www.astrology-online.com/persn.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elements_of_the_zodiac
http://www.astrojyoti.com/nakshatrachart.htm

Set · Post by **Set** » Tue Jan 03, 2006 1:52 pm

Excelsia wrote:January 22, 1986 (guess who'll be 20 in less than a month!)

Chinese: Tiger (I already knew I was a tiger, but the Yahoo thing told me I was an ox. I double-checked with some other sites, and tiger it is. Some of you might want to double check as well.)

Keep in mind the Chinese zodiac goes by the lunar calendar, not the solar one we use. The beginning of the year can vary. It tends to fluctuate between the months of January and February. Since you were born in January that's why you're getting a conflict.

The ox year didn't end until February 8th. You're really a wood ox. (The elements for each year are listed in a book I have. If you're curious as to yours give me the date you were born - the full one, day and everything - and I'll tell you.)

23Jarden · Post by **23Jarden** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:28 pm

Birthdate: August 12th, 1991

Western: Leo
Oriental: Goat
Celtic: The Hazel Tree
Egyptian: Horus
Native American: Stergeon

Drat almost all of them named me... It's true I have a voracious appetite... GO! GOATS!

Black Shuck · Post by **Black Shuck** » Sun Jan 08, 2006 10:52 pm

Here's mine:
Western: Aquarius
Chinese: Snake
Celtic: Luis (Rowan Tree)
Egyptian: Amon-Ra
Native American: Otter