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I kinda agree with outwarddoodles, but Im pretty shure the sperm will mutate by the virus, its unavoidable.

Shadow Wulf wrote:I kinda agree with outwarddoodles, but Im pretty shure the sperm will mutate by the virus, its unavoidable.

Why would the sperm mutate? I sappose sperm can mutate from different things but how would the virus exactly do that? Why would the virus be messing with chromosomes, those needed to make a baby. If lycanthropy is more like a virus as I imagine I don't see why it's going to completely mess with DNA even before fertilization of babies.

Won"t the virus spread all around the body ene the the reproductive system? A werewolf has to change at a cellular level, its not like its going to occur naturally. Are you basically saying that if a werewolf were to have babies, thew babies would be humans, cause I find that Kinda inaccurate.

The virus is suspoed to spread throughout teh body in order for it to trnasform. If its screwing with the female reproductive system in geenral shape and cycle.., tehn it will effect teh males as well in different ways.

Virus's want to spread and make more copies of itself. A part of this could be a symbiotic relationship so that "born" werewolves could carry either a dormant version of teh virus already installed in their genetic make up, of a semi-active version. ;)

hehe

Shadow Wulf wrote:Won"t the virus spread all around the body ene the the reproductive system? A werewolf has to change at a cellular level, its not like its going to occur naturally. Are you basically saying that if a werewolf were to have babies, thew babies would be humans, cause I find that Kinda inaccurate.

I've come to think of lycanthropy as being like a virus. The person is 'human based' and the 'virus' invades the body and changes the shape into something like a wolf, but not changing the reproductive systems when shifting, absolutly not touching it at all. The babies would be born a werewolf, they would get it from the mother, yet the virus would be sexually transmitted.

I think of a werewolf as in the shape of or resembling a wolf, not precisely a wolf. Yet thats how I seem to think it out, I don't know how it's being set for FreeBorn.

Trinity wrote:The virus is suspoed to spread throughout teh body in order for it to trnasform. If its screwing with the female reproductive system in geenral shape and cycle.., tehn it will effect teh males as well in different ways.

Virus's want to spread and make more copies of itself. A part of this could be a symbiotic relationship so that "born" werewolves could carry either a dormant version of teh virus already installed in their genetic make up, of a semi-active version. ;)

hehe

thats what I mean, if a human male were to be bitten into a werewolf, the disease or virus or whatever, would spread all over the body infecting the sperm to, so it basicaly mutates it.

Go check the Silver Corner for more of teh "solid" info for teh movie. There is only one thread with a good number of posts. For rigth now.., until its changed.., that's "cannon" for the movie.

outwarddoodles wrote:

Shadow Wulf wrote:Won"t the virus spread all around the body ene the the reproductive system? A werewolf has to change at a cellular level, its not like its going to occur naturally. Are you basically saying that if a werewolf were to have babies, thew babies would be humans, cause I find that Kinda inaccurate.

I've come to think of lycanthropy as being like a virus. The person is 'human based' and the 'virus' invades the body and changes the shape into something like a wolf, but not changing the reproductive systems when shifting, absolutly not touching it at all. The babies would be born a werewolf, they would get it from the mother, yet the virus would be sexually transmitted.

I think of a werewolf as in the shape of or resembling a wolf, not precisely a wolf. Yet thats how I seem to think it out, I don't know how it's being set for FreeBorn.

not shifting silly, I know it want effecty the reproductive system when its already a werewolf, I mean when a human had just been bitten by a werewolf, his/her whole body will change even the reproductive system.

Shadow Wulf wrote:

Trinity wrote:The virus is suspoed to spread throughout teh body in order for it to trnasform. If its screwing with the female reproductive system in geenral shape and cycle.., tehn it will effect teh males as well in different ways.

Virus's want to spread and make more copies of itself. A part of this could be a symbiotic relationship so that "born" werewolves could carry either a dormant version of teh virus already installed in their genetic make up, of a semi-active version. ;)

hehe

thats what I mean, if a human male were to be bitten into a werewolf, the disease or virus or whatever, would spread all over the body infecting the sperm to, so it basicaly mutates it.

Mutating Sperms and Eggs arn't going to be good for the werewolf at all, as I said there needs to be 'fill in the blank' spots inwhich the virus does not transform, the virus is going to be all through out the body but is not going to change eggs or sperk and hopefully not reproductive parts too much.

it want change the sperm like physacly is that what your saying, I dont mean the eggs are going to be bigger or anything like that, Im just saying the male werewolf sperm will be different from a humans if examined.

not shifting silly, I know it want effecty the reproductive system when its already a werewolf, I mean when a human had just been bitten by a werewolf, his/her whole body will change even the reproductive system.

I think the onyl reason they may change is the changing of the body and circumstances such as posibbly stress, so its a posibility they may mutate a bit, and extra tail or too. Yet eventually the body may be able to correct it's self. Yet what I though you were pointing at, but am unsure, is the sperm changing completely as if into wolf sperm or some new type of weird sperm with differnt chromosomes than what should realy go there. Being 'human based' they are going to need to be regular human chromosomes kept in those sperm.

As I am seeing it the, the most the sperm and and egg will change is that it carries the virus.

From that perspective:

Male werewolves can't get human females pregnant -
a ) the human female body will reject anythign that isn't up to "human standard". The sperm is carrying the virus, and thus "sick".
b ) The resulting fetus is also considered a "mutation" and not healthy for the human female body to carry. So it will naturaly abort it.

Female werewolves can't get preggers by human males-
a ) The human reproductive system is a harsh enviroment as it is, and a werewolf' doubly so. So the non-infected human sperm subbcumb and die off before reaching the womb at all.
b ) The result fetus would be constantly bombarded with teh virus while within the womb, and possibly be foreced to shift and change with the moon cycles just as any, causing an early abort.


OR On the flip side:

Having sex ( like in Lobo Leo's comic ) with a werewolf is nearly as easy to transferr the virus. Much liek HIV and AIDS. So no matter what happens, it won't matter both partners will eb carrying the "infected" reproductive cells. And since teh reproductive internal systems are also 'infected', they offer a neutral/safe place for 'infected' fetuses to grow.

Now this is taking into account nothing more then a dormanat style virus beign in the system, a fully active virus, or a partialy dormant virus in some cases.

I don't see teh cells themselves as morphing into a hybrid structure, just carrying the 'infection' of lyncathropy.

exactly, thats what I meant by mutation. Its going to be diffrerent from a human sperm because it carries the virus, so it may not look different but its different nontheless

Well, if you look at it that way then there's another way of becoming a werewolf. So basically the first time the female wouldn't get pregnant. But when the virus had changed the male, she could.

I figured that lycanthropy was sexually transmitted. A kid/pup of a werewolf invariably would have lycanthropy, and so would both parents.

*chuckles* so having unsafe sex with a human has a chance of making another werewolf? HAHAHAHAHAHA!!

XD

Make sure you have condoms becuase it's not just AIDS you can get! Poor people if only they would stop mating the virus would die...

Okay, so... hi by the way, I'm new to the forums and figured I would start checking out some of the ongoing threads. This one was the shortest, so it got the first bit of my attention.

A lot of my thoughts were already covered by a great many people... But I do however have a question... or two... or more *shrugs*

So we are talking about the general possibilities of werewolves both male and female, conceiving children. My question then, is what happens when they succeed?

During a shift, the body itself would be changing so much, what would happen to the unborn child? Obviously, in the earliest stages of development it wouldn't make much of a difference, considering how small a fetus really is. But what about the third trimester and so forth, when the baby is almost completely formed?

And that of course is going off the assumption that the female gets pregnant in human form. The discussion is currently ongoing about what would happen when a werewolf and a human get together, but what about a werewolf and a wolf.

If that's the case then what kind of baby(ies) would the mother end up carrying. It would change dramatically either way.


If I had to put an opinion to my own question, I would have to say that the mother (assuming she was a werewolf and not human/wolf) would end up being forced to stay in the form she was in when the child was conceived once she hit around month 6. Not so much a (she shouldn't change because it would hurt the baby) but a (she can't change because nature wouldn't let her).

First of all welcome to the pack Sundown
Second of all you could have introduced yourself here
http://calypso-blue.com/werewolf/viewto ... sc&start=0
if you wanted to

Sundown wrote: During a shift, the body itself would be changing so much, what would happen to the unborn child? Obviously, in the earliest stages of development it wouldn't make much of a difference, considering how small a fetus really is. But what about the third trimester and so forth, when the baby is almost completely formed?

heh...I remember asking that question. I don't think its been answered.

guess we'll never know.

And

Sundown wrote:Okay, so... hi by the way, I'm new to the forums and figured I would start checking out some of the ongoing threads. This one was the shortest, so it got the first bit of my attention.

A lot of my thoughts were already covered by a great many people... But I do however have a question... or two... or more *shrugs*

So we are talking about the general possibilities of werewolves both male and female, conceiving children. My question then, is what happens when they succeed?

During a shift, the body itself would be changing so much, what would happen to the unborn child? Obviously, in the earliest stages of development it wouldn't make much of a difference, considering how small a fetus really is. But what about the third trimester and so forth, when the baby is almost completely formed?

And that of course is going off the assumption that the female gets pregnant in human form. The discussion is currently ongoing about what would happen when a werewolf and a human get together, but what about a werewolf and a wolf.

If that's the case then what kind of baby(ies) would the mother end up carrying. It would change dramatically either way.


If I had to put an opinion to my own question, I would have to say that the mother (assuming she was a werewolf and not human/wolf) would end up being forced to stay in the form she was in when the child was conceived once she hit around month 6. Not so much a (she shouldn't change because it would hurt the baby) but a (she can't change because nature wouldn't let her).

Actually Fig I think we covered that question in another area..., let me see if I can find it. I htink it was in the "True Form" thread.


One of teh suggestions is that the hormonal imbalance caused by pregnancy woul dmake it increasingly difficult for the female to shift forms.

She would then be stuck in a form, until she gave birth. This is where it connects to one's "True form". Perhaps.

As for generalities, IF the uterus were to -also shift ( which is assumed that it does, it seems, by a majority ), then the fetus would have to have some form of adaptation in order to NOT be aborted.

Trinity wrote:
Actually Fig I think we covered that question in another area..., let me see if I can find it. I htink it was in the "True Form" thread.


One of teh suggestions is that the hormonal imbalance caused by pregnancy woul dmake it increasingly difficult for the female to shift forms.

She would then be stuck in a form, until she gave birth. This is where it connects to one's "True form". Perhaps.

Oh...ok...I must've missed that one. It also makes perfect sence.

Got the thread.., wow it got buried quick, and for such a potent thread too!

http://calypso-blue.com/werewolf/viewtopic.php?t=1035

My 'weres' have small babies, 3-4 lbs for a species who's humanoid form is 6+ft tall. Which solves the entire shifting at the end of a pregnancy.

Why would the uturus change? The form is basically the same, only the horns are longer. I can go with the stuck in one form part Jennifer Robinson (If I remember correctly) has it not safe for her shifters to shift form when pregnant, but I can't remember why

Humans do not have a horned uterus. They have Falopian tubes which -cannot- support life like the uterus can.

http://www.puppygal.com/images/femalegenitalsystem.jpg
http://www.bio.davidson.edu/people/jepu ... male2.jpeg


If a woman has a tubal preganacy, it has to be ended or it can kill the woman. Sometimes its so far along that a partical Hysterectomy needs to be done in order to save the woman's life.

There are instances where some human females have a "divided" uterus, and the complications of that can be dire, Including a fetus that is deformed from teh lack of room to grow.., or born dead because the head was crushed by the uterine walls.

There was a particularly intresting episode on Discovery Health that talked about one owman who had an under weight but otherwise mostly healthy baby. She had had a divided uterus. So it can happen.., but its rare.

So if the werewolf has a hybrid reproductive system, it may not "shift" with the rest of the body. But if one is going from wolf to human and back, the internal organs are going to change just to -fit- inside teh different body cavitites. Thus perhaps having a hybrid uterus that is smaller, and thus, as was mentioned above, smaller sized offspring.., would make more sense.



But if the goign consensus is that the werewolf is mostly human, with the abiality to change forms.., then the same agruement of needing to fit organs inside a different body cavity needs a different answer.

Unless, that is, you want your wolves to have a human uterus, or your humans to have a wolf uterus.

Otheriwse its is going to shift between the different forms. Anykind of serious level of change like that is going to -dislodge- the unbilicus and cause the body to abort the fetus(es). That is if it doesn't -squish- the fetuses after a certain stage of growth.

So the questions still stands, as to how "human" the werewolf is, versus how "hybrid" it is.

*chuckles8 Ah so convuluted neh?