Reverting

[Silverclaw]

OK, so high levels of adrenaline caused by the full moon usally will force a newbie werewolf into shifting. But what causes them to shift back? Would the sun coming up turn them back into humans? I dont now, they could still be freaking out and be surging with adrenaline. Maybe they would have to focus on their human form to begin changing back; or lose a lot of energy. Hmm, not sure. What do you think?

[Mitternacht]

Possibily they woudl , yes have the rush but burn through it before dawn? Or possibily the dawn woudl trigger memories of their human life and trigger it that wasy?

-MItty

[Figarou]

OK, so high levels of adrenaline caused by the full moon usally will force a newbie werewolf into shifting. But what causes them to shift back? Would the sun coming up turn them back into humans? I dont now, they could still be freaking out and be surging with adrenaline. Maybe they would have to focus on their human form to begin changing back; or lose a lot of energy. Hmm, not sure. What do you think?

The sun changing them back?

Heh, I'm having flashbacks of that FangFace cartoon I used to watch when I was young.

What made it odd is that a picture of the moon changes him to a werewolf and a picture of the sun changes him back.

It would be so funny if one of the werewolves in this movie shows a picture of a full moon to another pack member expecting him to shift.

[Terastas]

One theory is that it's not the full moon itself, but the psychological factors associated with the full moon that trigger the shift. So, if the full moon naturally enduces an adrenaline rush, a rookie werewolf might revert back to human form when exposed to an element of nature which enduces a state of relaxation.
Like a sunrise, for example.

[Figarou]

One theory is that it's not the full moon itself, but the psychological factors associated with the full moon that trigger the shift.

Hmmmmm

So, if the full moon naturally enduces an adrenaline rush, a rookie werewolf might revert back to human form when exposed to an element of nature which enduces a state of relaxation.
Like a sunrise, for example.

Ooookaaayy....Why did the werewolf changed back to human when the full moon was covered in the movie Van Helsing? He didn't get relaxed all of a sudden. I know that theory isn't new.

[Terastas]

So, if the full moon naturally enduces an adrenaline rush, a rookie werewolf might revert back to human form when exposed to an element of nature which enduces a state of relaxation.
Like a sunrise, for example.

Ooookaaayy....Why did the werewolf changed back to human when the full moon was covered in the movie Van Helsing? He didn't get relaxed all of a sudden. I know that theory isn't new.

Because that was a classic Hollywood dick flick.

I mean... Really! You could make an argument for why a full moon might cause a transformation, but if magic isn't involved (and I think a lot of people, staff and fans alike, have been against that), what would possess him to change back every time a cloud floats by?

[Silverfang]

I thought we were out to dispell the werewolf legend So why should they shift back at sunrise?

Maybe just relaxing or some meditaion to help them revert could be an idea....



.......or just crashing on the couch and watching TV works as well

[Figarou]

Because that was a classic Hollywood dick flick.

Strange way of putting it.

I mean... Really! You could make an argument for why a full moon might cause a transformation, but if magic isn't involved (and I think a lot of people, staff and fans alike, have been against that), what would possess him to change back every time a cloud floats by?

I'm not going to argue. I find that to be stupid myself. I didn't like that idea when I saw Van Helsing.

If some werewolves have total control, they could shift during broad daylight. I see nothing wrong with that. They'll be easier to spot, yes. No darkness to hide in.

[Terastas]

I thought we were out to dispell the werewolf legend So why should they shift back at sunrise?

Maybe just relaxing or some meditaion to help them revert could be an idea....

.......or just crashing on the couch and watching TV works as well

*nod-nods* That's what I was building off of initially. It's really more or less the werewolf psychology that determines the shift, but the origins of some legends can be explained psychologically. So instead of a werewolf changing into a wolf at the full moon and changing back into a man at daybreak, he instead shifts into a wolf when his adrenaline is high and reverts back when his adrenaline is low.

Of course, though the legends themselves are not true, it might be interesting to specify their origins. The full moon, for example, has a psychological affect on people, which chould be attributed to an increase in adrenaline, and a sunrise is one of few things in the world that is considered to be beautiful by all cultures worldwide, so the psychological affect of a sunrise would be a decrease in adrenaline.

So there's nothing actually written that a werewolf becomes a wolf at the full moon and shifts back at daybreak, but if you consider the possibility that those two elements in nature and their affect on adrenaline, it's easy to understand why people in medeival times might have believed such. Don't forget, way back when the legends were first chronicled, psychology as a concept didn't exist.

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

I'm in favor of a true werewolf being able to shift to and from whenever they want, but certain things can cause a shift like pain, rage, ect.. I can think of anything that might force a them back into human form though. Most feelings when pushed to the extreme would force a shift to the more emotional form which to me is the werewolf one.

[Suho Wolf]

I think that there are probably other hormones and physiological processes at work than just the adrenaline surge; if this is the case (without considering the times when a werewolf may be able to self-induce a transformation based solely on psychological 'training') then it would make sense that a reversion would be triggered when the body stops maintaining the 'hormone' cycles that hold him in the transformed state, or when he has metabolized all of the triggering compound(s) in his blood.

These are vague statements, but provide a general theory. I like the proposal that the moon has an effect on the werewolf, not for its moonbeams or reflective light, but rather for its cyclical and gravitational properties. Maybe it affects his immune system on some level, allowing the 'agents of change' to overcome his resistance.

One could even posit that given the widescale spread of the myth that the moon itself is the trigger, a modern day werewolf may come to believe this is so and convince himself of this 'reality' on a subconcious level, becoming something of a self-fulfilling prophecy.

[Blade-of-the-Moon]

If you suscribe to the moon theory, then how about this: A werewolf can shapshift whenever it wants, but it gets harder to control as moon moves closer to being full. When it is full they have to transform wheter they want to or not.

[Suho Wolf]

I think that the moon theory as one factor on the change is powerful. Not the only factor, but probably one that becomes more significant as the moon goes through its cycles, and for that matter, it would be stronger or weaker in different seasons at different times of the year as it is closer or farther from the earth.

[Figarou]

Oooookaaaaay....

What would happen if the moon left the earth's orbit. What then?


Or another moon came out of nowhere and entered the orbit of our current moon?


Or something happens on the moon's surface that gives off a permanent green glow instead of white?


Or the moon breaks in 2.


Or man finds a way to turn it into a living breathing planet?

[Vuldari]

I have no new ideas to contribute to this conversation,(EDIT: Well...maybe just one.) but I feel I would like to state my opinion.

*The Moon has an effect on werewolves on a purely psycological level. If the WW in question does not notice the moon as anything of significance at the moment, it will have no effect at all. Contrarily, if they have convinced themselves that it will force them to shift, then it will.

*Many factors would be involved in how and when a transformation would be induced, (in either direction). ...mind-set...Hormone levels(Adreneline, etc.)...emotional state...and so on. Once a WW has become familiar with the "shifting muscle" in themself and what it feels like to flex it, they can learn to shift on command, day or night. However, "involuntary" shifts woluld still be as unavoidable in a WW's life as coughing and sneezing. (though not as frequent or easy to trigger.) You can learn to do those things intentionally, but no one can claim to have gained such mastory over those actions that they NEVER do it involuntarily.
Fear... Rage... Pain... Passion... or even a random spike of hormone levels in the body, (part of some normal biological cycle)...could trigger an involuntary Shift.


Okay...here is a new train of thought inspired by the subject topic. Why would calming down cause a shift? A transformation is a transformation regardless of if it is from Man to Wolf, or Wolf to Man, and it would require just as much energy to accomplish.

So far, the attitude that seems to be generally accepted is that being in the Wolf form is like flexing your muscles and pumping yourself up to your maximum strength, and returning to normal is a relaxation of those muscles. When the juice runs out, you deflate. However, the more I think about it, the less that makes sense. When a Werewolf in Wolf form wants to return to their human shape, they must undergo another transformation just as dramatic as the one that made them as they are at the moment. This would be a very significant and physically taxing event, and so it seems a VERY good question for Silverclaw to have asked...
"What DOES trigger the shift into Human form?"

I would have to guess that it would be something that indicates a need for that form. The triggers for a W-Shift seem to be threats to the persons safety, requiring a stronger form to protect it. A Werewolfs only need for their Human form (that I can think of now) is concealment. I guess then the question becomes, "What stimuli would trigger an instinctive desire to hide?"

[Suho Wolf]

Okay,

I am not addressing the variations on a moon theme, but the reversion shift and its cause. I tend to think a theory based on agents acting in the werewolf's blood has at least one explanation: as I already mentioned somewhere, once the adrenaline is stopped the muscles would start to revert. Someone on another post (sounded like a law enforcement officer) talked about the different durations of adrenalized stress.

Although I am a bit rusty on the details, I know that this is true and that prolonged periods of adrenalized stress exist but are ultimately harmful to humans on a long term basis.

Whether adrenaline or another compound/hormone, once metabolized a werewolf would start to revert. A big difference here, is that when I use the word revert I am sure I do not speak for most or all other users in that I don't view the physical change to be that dramatic or as physically taxing. As I have posted elsewhere, I think most humans turned werewolf (possible exceptions for other situations) don't physically change too much, mostly it is in the head. This is not a popular view, because it doesn't avail itself to awesome special effects and lupine giant creatures, but that is my view.

[Terastas]

This might be a stretch, but it could be that the moon has absolutely no direct affect on werewolves, but is instead an important event to them culturally.

If you'll pardon a lame-a** description of events, I'm going to use the book I'm writing as an example:
In my own defintion that I'm working on, werewolves and vampires are natural enemies (I know, I know, Underworld Rip-off, but please, just go with it). Humans naturally associate one with the other and persecute them indescriminantly, but there is one key difference that both will be quick to point out: werewolves are photogenic and vampires are ultraviolet intolerant. Therefore, whenever a werewolf pack takes the offensive against a vampire family, they do so during a full moon, which produces enough light to slightly enhance the lycanthropic regeneration and enough ultraviolet light to stunt the vampiric regeneration. Both effects are minor and easilly overlooked on their own, but the two combined give the werewolves an advantage worth taking.

So the full moon isn't the direct cause of the shift; just the most ideal time to do it. Maybe the same could have been true of the werewolves of legend. Maybe, for example, since they were so heavilly persecuted by the Church and its followers, they could only meet at night and chose the night of the full moon to do so because it is the brightest celestial object at night, that way they would have been able to travel to the midnight meetings without the assistance of a torch or something else that might have drawn attention to them.
Does that make sense, or do I need to get more sleep?

[Figarou]

Does that make sense, or do I need to get more sleep?

Get more sleep.

*Starts hypnotic trance*

"You are getting sleepy...very sleeeeeeeepy"

<----sleepy wolf.

[Stone Wolf]

Hmmm... interesting hypothosis. It does make more sense than the whole Full Moon causing a transformation bit...., but that's just my opinion. Personally I think the whole reason for the myth is that the only time humans could ever catch a glimpse of the Lycans is during the full moon.

[Kzinistzerg]

It also could be that werewolves require the moon to shift but it dosen't force them too.

[Stone Wolf]

Another interesting point....

[Silverfang]

Does that make sense, or do I need to get more sleep?

Get more sleep.

*Starts hypnotic trance*

"You are getting sleepy...very sleeeeeeeepy"

<----sleepy wolf.

Sooooo Sleepy ........Zzzzzzz

[Figarou]

This might be a stretch, but it could be that the moon has absolutely no direct affect on werewolves, but is instead an important event to them culturally.

How in the world did I miss this? Must've been sleepy myself.


N E Who Terastas could be right about that.

[Kzinistzerg]

Oh, yay, another emoticon...

[Silverclaw]

I dont think that when the sun rises, a werewolf will suddenly turn back into a human. Even during a clear day, you can usally still see the moon. Anyway, I would think that a werewolf would have to calm down and concentrate to turn into a human again. The first few times would most likely be a fustrating time. Newbies will still be pumped full of adrenaline and then be surprised they were not turning back to normal in morning light. That may even cause them to panic, hence more adreneline. It would be best if an experenced ww explained things before paw.