How do you feel about Wolf Dogs?

Anook · Post by **Anook** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 11:57 am

How do you feel about wolf dogs and what is your opininon on them?
Yes, they are beautiful animals, but I've read that they are really hard to take care of.

I'm starting to think that there might be more wolf dogs then actual wolves. In my opinion they shouldn't breed the two together. We need more pure wolves at there, not wolf dogs!

Please share your thoughts on this matter.

Ancient · Post by **Ancient** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 12:35 pm

I think that wolf dogs or wolf hybrids as they are often called could pose a real danger to inexperianced owners. Many owners do not understand the special care that is required when owning such an animal. Although the proud owner of a rescued wolf hybrid named Omen. I can honestly say that in inexperianced and uneducated hands he could pose a real danger. Not only to people, but himself and even other dogs. I personaly think that they should not breed wolf dogs. Wolves are meant to be in the wild and dogs are meant to be domestic. When breeding the two together you get different traits that sometimes contradict eachother. In short wolves should be wolves and dogs should be dogs. Although beautiful wolf hybrids should probably in a perfect world not happen.

Anook · Post by **Anook** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 12:42 pm

What does your wolf hybrid look like?
I know he looks like a wolf, but what color fur does he have?

alphanubilus · Post by **alphanubilus** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 2:12 pm

Living in Oklahoma, where wolf-dog and wolf-wolf hybrids is a rage I can tell you that most people that hybridize wolves with dogs deliberately choose dog breeds that are wolf like, such as huskies or German Shepherds. In both cases the wolf hybrid retains much of its wolf features, since both dogs Shepherds and huskies look like wolves, or at least closer in appearance than other canines.

We do have wolf breeders in Oklahoma who legally breed and sell wolves. I know a lot of people who own them, and honestly, from what they say, if you love them and let them feel like they are apart of your family (in love and discipline) they are extremely loving animals.

A lot of the "horror" stories you hear about unstable hybrids attacking their owners is largely due to an unstable owner. These are the types that treat a dog in the family as just that a dog... an outsider, and not an integral part of a working psuedo-pack.

I am not really concerned as much with the wolf-dog hybrid or the "Domesticated" wolf, as opposed to ferral dog issues. Australia has suffered greatly due to these ferral pooches.

Ferral dogs in the US due pose a threat to real wolves. This is why people need to WATCH their dogs, have them fixed if needs be, and stop abandoning their dogs. In other words, people need to be responsible.

Anubis · Post by **Anubis** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 3:50 pm

Even though i would like a wolf-dog, but i learned that breeding these beautiful animals with dogs isn't ethical. like people said before, often these animals get owners that just want them because they are "cool" and don't know what they are doing. They'll leave them out side and neglect them and they can't get proper medical treatment because most commercial veterinary facilities aren't equipped and licensed to treat wild animals. And end up feral and hurt somebody.

These are wild animals even though if they have less than 50% wolf in them they are still wild animals. Not to mention that these hybrids have no real place in the world. They are too tame or in some cases too wild to be in the wild, and they can't be taken care of like normal house pets. They need a lot of space, a proper diet, and proper medical care. they have no real place in the conventional world. They need to be kept like wild animals that are born in captivity or be taken care of by people that have experience on these misfits. And not to mention a complete hault on breeding these animals. it should be against the law to intentionaly breed them.

theMoonlite · Post by **theMoonlite** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 4:37 pm

I had a wolfdog, I named him Azlan. ^^ I have some pictures, if you'd like to see him. He's the one without the white face--And the one with the white face, that's his brother, Cletus. They now both live in West Virginia, where my good friend, Mark, is watching him. He raised the father, and he wanted to take care of my boy for me. Funny thing was, Azlan was born as a runt, prematurely, and everyone thought he was going to die. And, the same thing for me, in real life. So, it was like destiny we were going to meet, and we've bonded really well. Oh, and Azlan was my first ever wolfdog.

He's 50% timberwolf, 25% German Shep. and 25% Chow-Chow. ^^

I do miss him so much, but he's happy in West Virginia.

Anook · Post by **Anook** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 6:20 pm

I really like the pictures.

But I was looking at wolf hybrid groups on the internet and their animals
were like 97% wolf or more and 4% malamute, husky, or german sheperd.

I mean there was a black hybrid with yellow eyes that looked like a wolf more than anything.

If it did have some dog in him, you wouldn't be able to tell.

Ancient · Post by **Ancient** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 7:09 pm

My wolf dog named Omen is black with a white blaze on his chest and brown eyese much like those of a German Shep.. He is a German Shep., Timber Wolf mix. Black seems to be a dominate color among dogs in general. I don't know alot about his history seeing that he was rescued.

Anook · Post by **Anook** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 7:22 pm

Oh, I wish you would post pictures , if you were able to.
He sounds like a very beautiful dog. I don't think wolves and dogs should breed together, but I do think wolf hybrids are very beautiful animals.

Alpha · Post by **Alpha** » Sun Jun 18, 2006 9:33 pm

It's funny that you should bring this topic up. I'm a letter carrier for the Postal Service and about 3-4 months ago I believe I came across such an animal. I've been on the same route now for about 6 years, so I'm pretty familiar with all of the dogs on it. So imagine my surprise when I entered the yard of this one house and found myself face to face with what I can only describe as a Timber wolf. This thing may have been mixed, but it looked to be 100% wolf to me. Anyways, it wasn't being aggressive or anything, but it was staring at me intently. Feeling uneasy, I slowly backed-up with my hand on the dog spray just in case. A couple of days later when I saw the homeowner and asked her about it, she said that she had no idea who it belonged to. I've never seen it again since.

Voidmaw · Post by **Voidmaw** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 12:29 am

I don't agree with keeping wolves as pets, or hybridizing wolves. Millions of fine dogs are killed every year in US shelters. Animals we troubled to domesticate. If you've done your research, taking in a rescue wolfdog, over a puppy from a breeder, would be another issue entirely.

Aside from this, there are a lot of people who mistake percentages. Such as the dog in the photo above. Here is a comparison photo, linked to show a dog that actually is 50% wolf: http://www.wolfpark.org/wolfdogs/figures/figure016.JPG
I highly doubt the canine in "TheMoonlite's" post contains any amount of wolf blood whatsoever.

Here is an excellent article on the subject of distinguishing wolves from dogs, and percentages: http://www.wolfpark.org/wolfdogs/Poster_section1.html

This may also prove useful, if a bit long - hopefully forgiven:

Wolf
Feet and toes.
Hair will protrude between the pads of the foot. Usually a reddish color.
Lots of space between pads on feet. Pads are not rounded.
Toes point outward and are elongated.
Rear legs are cow hocked.
Toenails and pads are always black.
No dewclaw in the rear.
Teeth.
Large Canines and premolars
Premolars are well-formed, no spacing.
Dark pigmentation at gum line near the teeth. No spots on gums
Tail.
Tail is “brush tail”
Tail does not curl up
Has black patch at precaudal gland (a few inches down from the base). Also black tip at end of the tail.
Reproductive system.
Wolves only breed once a year starting in late January to Mid March.
Wolves do not come into their first heat until two years of age (generally)
Head and ears.
Eyes are angled and yellow (generally)
Lack of furrow between eyes
Gentle slope without protruding brow, domed forehead or pronounced stop.
Muzzle is long, not heavy or broad
Head in not boxy like domestic dogs
Medium size erect ears
Inside ears are heavily furred
Nose is always black, never pink.

Wolf-hybrid
Feet and toes.
No hair protruding between pads.
Pads are very close and rounded
Toes point forward
Legs are straight and point forward
Toenails are marked with pink or white
Dewclaw in the rear
Teeth.
Smaller canines and premolars
Wide spacing between premolars
No dark pigmentation at gumline near teeth. Spots on gums.
Tail.
Tail is "flagged"
Tail curls upward over back
No black patch at precaudal gland or tip of tail
Reproductive system.
Signs of breeding other than January to March.
First heat cycle before two years of age
Head and ears.
Eyes are round, different color eyes, not yellow
Furrow between eyes
Domed head, protruding brow, domed forehead, and pronounced stop. Boxy head
Short muzzle, broad, or heavy
Large or floppy ears
Little or no fur inside ears
Nose has pink

Morkulv · Post by **Morkulv** » Mon Jun 19, 2006 4:13 am

Voidmaw wrote:I don't agree with keeping wolves as pets, or hybridizing wolves. Millions of fine dogs are killed every year in US shelters. Animals we troubled to domesticate. If you've done your research, taking in a rescue wolfdog, over a puppy from a breeder, would be another issue entirely.

We agree to disagree.

Renorei · Post by **Renorei** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 8:37 am

I'm not against keeping wolves as pets....after all, where did the first dogs come from?

Though I do agree with what Voidmaw said about it being a shame that dogs are being killed in shelters all the time, while people are out finding wolves as pets. There's no reason to go out of your way to keep a wolf or wolfdog as a pet, when there are perfectly good dogs in your local shelter, waiting for adoption.

IMO (and this applies to nearly all types of animals) getting a particular animal just because you think it is 'cool' isn't justification enough to get it. And more than likely, you'll probably be a bad pet owner. Furthermore, you don't really deserve the animal.

There's no real benefit that can be gained from a pet owner by owning a wolf or wolfdog that couldn't be gotten from a regular dog....aside from the coolness, and that's just not a good enough reason.

Anook · Post by **Anook** » Tue Jun 20, 2006 3:02 pm

Yeah, I agree

23Jarden · Post by **23Jarden** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 2:25 pm

The wolf dogs don't have such large mutton chops... I think people should raise those dogs that look like wolves instead of wolf dogs. it's around here somewhere...

Edit: I found it!
http://calypso-blue.com/werewolf/viewto ... t=wolflike

Anook · Post by **Anook** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:26 pm

Well, I can't see the picture since the webstie is under construction

vrikasatma · Post by **vrikasatma** » Wed Jun 21, 2006 6:34 pm

I know a few people who have wolf-dogs, and a few people who have WOLVES, two right here in Oregon. I would also like to point out that these people went into wolf or wolf-dog ownership fully educated, with their eyes wide open, and a multi-generational family tradition of keeping wolf hybrids and wolves to back them up.

One of the people that has a wolf has a large male. She has a 2.5-acre enclosure for him and only two or three people, herself included, are allowed to go in there with him (essentially, his pack). He's very playful. and everyone knows the lines which aren't crossed. She never leaves the property for more than 12 hours and ideally less: in other words, she's rooted and on a leash. She won't take him off the property and definitely won't let him mingle with the public at large. The wolf is emotionally very happy and alert. Judging from the photos and the stories she's told me, he's physically hale and hearty, too. There's enough of a market in this state that I've seen specifically-formulated wolf hybrid food for sale in the supermarket, and it's comprised of buffalo, pheasant and salmon meat. (Damn! Sounds pretty good to me)

If the human end of the pair can justify a lifestyle within those parameters and has the facilities and means to do it, great! No animal with a stable home, room to play, friendly company and a full belly is unhappy. Personally I think that humans should be licensed to own a wolf or wolf hybrid and make the licensing procedure the same as big cat owners and falconers go through: apprenticeship with a licensed owner for 2-4 years, written test and facilities inspection.

I think husky/malamute-wolf hybrids are okay. Working (as opposed to AKC) huskies and malamutes are only one step away from wolves anyway.