Genetic Diversity

[Lycanthrope]

You're right about this one.
There's much discussion about whether viruses are alive or not. If we generalize, they are built pretty like a string of genetic information and most they do is just attaching to the infected cell's DNA, forcing the cell to copy it (Along with the virus), de-attach and spread on. Like AIDS. Bacterias, on the other hand, are alive. They're actually living cells and as far as I know they don't interact with the DNA.
If Lycanthropy is caused about something biological, it is rather something similar to the virus but it's so... unromantic. I'd rather stay with more supernatural explanations.

[Vuldari]

*"viruses" (*we really need to come up with a diferent word to describe it)

Er, I'm not sure what word you're looking for. I don't think "bacteria" would work but I don't know much about microscopic...things.

What I meant was, no one seems to want to call it a "Virus" or "bacteria" or "disease", so I was proposing that we make up a name for the Werewolf Contagion like the way we named the Hybrid form ("Gestalt"). That way, the argument about wheter it is a virus or not would not have to be re-kindled every time someone mentions the Werewolf Contagion.

[Figarou]

We already have the word. ----->

...Oh Figarou...think fast!

Huh? Wha? Think?

[Akugarou]

would the person's individual DNA they already have form with the new werewolf genes and form as a whole new werewolf.

I'm gonna go with this one. From what little I know about genetics, you would get an individual, not (what would basically be) a clone.

[outwarddoodles]

Okay, lets rule out the gender change thing. *ahem*

I'm guessing most of us think the werewolf will, or should, have different genetic codes. But you must agree they still may become similair.

[Kzinistzerg]

May, but it's more likely to be chance.

[outwarddoodles]

No. It wnt be chance. As I said when a werewlf bites it places ITS DNA code inside the person, thus is why them being similair would be because of that, not chance. Though it depends on what DNA passed through and if it combines with the original humans to create a new one.

[Apokryltaros]

No. It wnt be chance. As I said when a werewlf bites it places ITS DNA code inside the person, thus is why them being similair would be because of that, not chance. Though it depends on what DNA passed through and if it combines with the original humans to create a new one.

The werewolf does not inject its own DNA code into its victim, it injects the contagion into its victim, which then procedes to alter DNA of the victim.

[Vilkacis]

May, but it's more likely to be chance.

No. It wnt be chance. As I said when a werewlf bites it places ITS DNA code inside the person, thus is why them being similair would be because of that, not chance. Though it depends on what DNA passed through and if it combines with the original humans to create a new one.

I agree that there wouldn't be any chance involved--the process would not be random. However, that is not to say that anyone would be able to predict the result. In this way, the outcome would seem random and due to chance. In the same sense that you wouldn't be able to predict whether a baby would have its mother's or its father's eyes, for example.

I would point out, however, that we have not (to my knowledge) determined that the werewolf's DNA is even passed on, rather than something that merely alters the bitten's DNA in a specific way.

-- Vilkacis

[outwarddoodles]

I beleive it has been explained that wen the teeth grow the gums bleed, and when someone is bitten the DNA passes that way. Also DNA is the code and informatin on what makes what what and thus is how it must spread. So I wuld say DNA does it.

[Set]

What is with all this talk of DNA? The only thing it determines is species. Genes are what actually determine how someone looks. Even I remember that.

[Apokryltaros]

I beleive it has been explained that wen the teeth grow the gums bleed, and when someone is bitten the DNA passes that way. Also DNA is the code and informatin on what makes what what and thus is how it must spread. So I wuld say DNA does it.

No, no, no.
The only mammals with DNA in their red blood cells are camels.
You must realize that DNA is not necessarily needed to cause changes to genes.
One can have a mutagen, made famous by the 1st cartoon of "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles."
Normally, a mutagen, or sometimes called a teratogen, is a chemical that causes damage to DNA, causing the nucleotides of the DNA to change or be replaced by wrong nucleotides. This then causes cancer if the cell(s) affected are body cells, or birth defects if the affected cells are eggs or sperm.

[outwarddoodles]

Heh, me confused now too.

[Beastofgaia]

hum i want explain my point of view about the transmission of a "WW DNA" i think that when a garou bite an human persons, if this person have ALREADY the potentiel of becoming a Garou, the transmission o something more mystical as a bound with the spirit world could more explain the fact of the Human become a garou... because the fact of speak about a "WW virus" or "WW DNA" is hurting me... a Garou is an mysticl being who lives between two worlds... one is mystical and protected by Spirits and the secong is more realist and physic, it's the human world... i think that the Garou bite ONLY transmit the perception of the other world and the capacity of changing... but all the physical caracters of the human are preserved...

[Lycanthrope]

Hmm... Have you taken that from White-Wolf games? I haven't played any yet, so I'd like to get sure...
Anyway, I agree with you that Werewolves should be more mistical. The blood is a great way to pass this "blessing", because it is very tied with magic. Just remind yourself all rituals, sacrifices and some disease-carrying undead (Yes Figarou - leeches, we know). Looking at them from science's point of view takes something away from their image. Still, I think that Spirits and their world might be too much, but hey... That what you think doesn't have to convince anybody, as long as you Feel it's right.
And welcome to "The Pack" BeastOfGaia!

[outwarddoodles]

Werewolves are fake (unless we're talking about therianthropy) So we sit here and enjoy trying to make them as real as posible. Do far we have
dna. I don't think being a werewolf is a virus but it seems to be discribed as that.

[Kzinistzerg]

probablyprompted bya virus semi-magical in nature. though, concievablyy, ifwe had REALLY advanced technology we couldake a werewolf. but not now.

[Vilkacis]

concievablyy, ifwe had REALLY advanced technology we couldake a werewolf. but not now.

It's funny:

I tried to make the same point somewhere else, once, when speaking of ways by which a lycanthrope could come about. Birthrights, curses, diseases, spiritual willpower, magic, and the like were all perfectly acceptable, but the moment I mentioned the use of technology (in the distant future, no less), they were all, like, "OooOoOoOo! That could never happen! How could that possibly work?"

Heh.

Okay, so that's a tad bit exaggerated, but that's how they came across.

-- Vilkacis

[Apokryltaros]

Werewolves are fake (unless we're talking about therianthropy) So we sit here and enjoy trying to make them as real as posible.

Please, the term is "reality-challenged."

probablyprompted bya virus semi-magical in nature. though, concievablyy, ifwe had REALLY advanced technology we couldake a werewolf. but not now.

Trust me, I've tried.
No luck.

concievablyy, ifwe had REALLY advanced technology we couldake a werewolf. but not now.

It's funny:

I tried to make the same point somewhere else, once, when speaking of ways by which a lycanthrope could come about. Birthrights, curses, diseases, spiritual willpower, magic, and the like were all perfectly acceptable, but the moment I mentioned the use of technology (in the distant future, no less), they were all, like, "OooOoOoOo! That could never happen! How could that possibly work?"

The use of retrovirii to insert as much wolf-genes as inhumanly possible into the subject's genome?
Or magical skin-grafting?

[Scott Gardener]

Famous last words: "That will never happen."

Over a hundred years ago, someone proposed closing the patent office, because everything that could possibly be invented had already been invented. That was before the automobile, airplane, radio, TV, central air conditioning, or personal computer, let alone all the multitude of other everyday items we take for granted.

The direction that technology is going is towards nanomolecular devices. A convergence of DNA-based computing and organic nanite robotics would pave the way towards plausibility, and both are in the concept stages today, with early prototypes in the making even now. Throw in a few decades, and AI computers will be able to help out in the process. I'm sure other things will be invented first, like cures for cancer; but, sooner or later cosmetic surgery applications will come into focus. Most people will just want to make themselves look like whatever is considered the ideal human form at the time. (Right now, men are preferreed athletic, and women are under tremendous pressure to be ultra-skinny. I suspect that by the time the tech rolls around, both genders will be pressured a bit more equally to be healthy and somewhat athletic. That's my guess.)

But, since there's enough people like us, sooner or later, body modifications will come up. I doubt a contageous virus would be a first choice without some sort of built-in check to keep it from spreading to unwilling recipients. But, in a plausible timeline we're less than 200 years away from werewolves being possible, and in a very optimistic timeline, we could be there inside of 50 years. (Optimistic in that the technology itself continues to follow Moore's law past the limits of Silicon, AIs develop early, society advances forward quickly in terms of consensus ethics and philosophy, and no major obstructions happen during the key steps of the process. For example, Bush's opposition to human cloning and stem cell research bogs down American contribution to research. While this does help boost scientists in Europe and eventually India as these countries take over lead roles in the 21st century, it delays research overall.)

[outwarddoodles]

*Points above.*

I agree.

[mielikkishunt]

what about a WW's DNA would make it so special as to affect changes on the person it's inflicted on? If I get my cats blood on/in me, it will not affect my DNA.

That's why I see the type where it's passed on by bite to be a virus. I wanna say one that acts kind of like the HIV virus, but I can't find my notes and a quick search of the 'net didn't help me. . .

[Apokryltaros]

what about a WW's DNA would make it so special as to affect changes on the person it's inflicted on? If I get my cats blood on/in me, it will not affect my DNA.

That's why I see the type where it's passed on by bite to be a virus. I wanna say one that acts kind of like the HIV virus, but I can't find my notes and a quick search of the 'net didn't help me. . .

We're not saying that werewolf DNA in and of itself is infectious. What we're trying to say is that werewolves have a virus that inserts the necessary genes that cause lycanthropy into the genome of the bitten victim (who survives the initial attack), and activates these inserted genes.

[Goldenwolf]

In my brand of werewolves, they have certain glands in their mouths (somewhat like saliva glands) that contain the contagion, or "venom" that they work into their saliva before biting someone. It acts as a virus, altering the persons cells and DNA. That way if the bite someone they didn't want to change and that person lived, no biggie. It has to be a concious effort on their part to bring the venom up and to work it into their saliva.

Anyway, I think it would act like a virus, yet be mystical in a way too. Let's face it, shapeshifting like that is NOT possible on a purely scientific level, however if you involve a little magic, a little mystery, then anything is possible ;)

[Figarou]

however if you involve a little magic, a little mystery, then anything is possible ;)

Magic is always the solution when someone is writing a story about werewolves. Its very difficult to go into scientific details when there is no shape shifting werewolves to study from.